Delineating Natal Chart

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Death of the Mother

In November 1945 his Mother died in a car accident.

Firdaria period is Jupiter/Sun.
So again the Sun in 3rd and ruler of 8th (and Almuten of 4th!) is on the field.

I assume that the Sun is significator of both parents because it is Almuten of the 4th.
Because Gianni at the moment was 24 years old his profected Ascendant was the same as at birth: in Sagittarius. So the natal promise is reinforced in those years (12/24/36 and etc..).

Again we have the 3/9 axis accentuated: short/long journeys/cars and etc.
November falls in the 9th natal house, and there we have Jupiter and Saturn.
You see how precise Astrology can be?

Solar Return Ascendant falls in Scorpio in natal 10th house (the House of Mother).
Ruler Mars is on IC with the Moon exactly on IC (Moon being natural significator of Mothers). IC is the place of Death and Ends as the Hellenistic Astrologers saw it.

In the same year his Grandfather died. Ruler of Solar Return's 4th - Saturn in the 8th of SR.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Car Accident

Health : Accident (Non-fatal) August 1952 (car accident, broke jaw, smashed leg)

Remember the Abu Ali's description for Saturn in 9th?
Saturn in 9th:
"indicates hard and awful dreams, weakness and loosing of the one's faith; diseases, troubles and loses on the long journeys"

This is Jupiter/Saturn Firdaria
Saturn is in 9th co-ruling the 1st, and ruling the 2nd.

In 1952 Profected Ascendant is in Cancer, that is the Intercepted sign on 7th house cusp.

Solar Return Ascendant is in Leo, natal 8th house.
Sun is in 8th Solar Return house falling in 3rd natal.
In august Solar Return progressed Month is in 6th house Capricorn, the ruler Saturn is in SR 3rd Retrograde, making opposition to Jupiter ruler of SR 8th.
Both, Jupiter and saturn are Firdaria rulers of the period.

 

[Omnisphericus]

As we can see in the analysis of the events above, the promised in the natal chart was distributed in the years in Life according to the Firdaria/Profection and Solar Returns rulerships of the periods.
Jupiter/Saturn conjunction (both Retrograde) in 9th in opposition to the Sun in 3rd ruler of 8th, was a significator of the 'promised' troubles in the natal chart regarding the journeys, parents death and etc.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Marriage

Relationship : Marriage November 1953 (Princess Marella Caraciolo di Castagneto)

In 1953 Gianni is 32 years old.

Lets find the Significator of Marriage.

1. 7th house cusp at 24 Gemini
Mercury 5, 3
Saturn 3
Jupiter 3
Mars 2
Sun 1

2. Ruler of 7th, Mercury in 4 Pisces,
Jupiter 5
Venus, 4, 3, 2
Mars 3
Moon 3
Saturn 1

3. Planets in 7th = None

4. Moon at 17 Aries
Mars 3
Sun 4, 3, 1
Jupiter 3
Saturn 3
Mercury 2

5. Venus at 3Taurus
Venus 5, 3, 2
Moon 4, 3
Mars 3
Mercury 1

6. Part of Marriage of Men at 5 Leo
Sun 5, 3
Jupiter 3, 2
Saturn 3, 1

Total:
Mercury 11
Saturn 11
Jupiter 16
Mars 11
Sun 17
Venus 19

Venus is significator of Marriage.
Venus is Succedent and in Domicile, in the house of good luck, not harmed by bad aspect, in oriental quarter. She rules the 10th, we can say that this man will take powerful woman with high status.
Moon is making aspect with only one planet in the sign in which she is (applying aspect). There will be one marriage only. Mars receives the Moon.

In 1953 Venus came on the natal Ascendant by Profection.
The Marriage was in November, counting 9 months (From March to November) we come to the sign of Leo and the Profected Ascendant (this corresponds with the Part of Marriage which falls in Leo).

Solar Return Ascendant falls in natal 10th house.
Venus, the Significator of Marriage (and SR Ruler) falls in SR 7th or natal 4th.
SR 9th house falls in natal 7th, counting 9 months from Ascendant Libra to the 9th Gemini we come to November and the month of the wedding.

So what we've done here?
We've progressed the SR Ascendant to the Natal DC (Which falls in SR 9th house).

1953 is Mars/Mars Firdaria.
Mars is on IC and ruler of IC and 11th in natal. Co-ruler of 1st by Exaltation.
Moon co-ruler of 7th is applying conjunction to Mars in natal.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Death of the Brother

Death of Sibling 1965 (Brother Giorgio died at 35).

As we saw in delineating the natal chart of Gianni Agnelli, the young death of the brother was signified.
Ruler of 8th in 3rd.

1965 is beginning of Sun/Sun Firdaria.
Sun in natal chart in 3rd, ruler of 8th, significations (Death of Brother). Mercury in 3rd also, is natural significator of Young Man.

Profected Ascendant in 1965 falls in Leo (8th house), and ruler is the Sun.
You see the connection?
The last time when Leo was Ascendant the marriage happened, but now death of brother. Firdaria rulership shows the clue of the happenings.

In SR Virgo Rising, Mercury in 7th house but 8th sign.
Mars, ruler of 3rd in SR and of 8th is in 12th and Retrograde.
Sun is exactly on DC.

You see the connection in the Solar Return chart?
Mars rules the 3rd - Brothers.
It rules also the 8th - Death.
It is in the house of Bad Spirit = 12th and in opposition to the Natal Sun in 3rd.

Or to put it in this way:
Loss (12) of Brother (3rd) by Death (8).

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Head of Fiat

Work : Gain social status 1966 (Head of Fiat)

In the year of 1966 he become Head of Fiat. He was then 35 years old.
This is one year after his brother died.

1966 is Sun/Venus Firdaria. Venus rules 10th - the house of Social Status.
10th is 8th from 3rd (derived houses), can we say that the native gains from the brothers death?
Venus is in 3rd from 3rd. The brother of his brother - i.e. he himself.

In 1966 Profection Ascendant came to Virgo, natal 9th house where we have Jupiter - the ruler of 1st and 3rd.

Primary Directions:
In 1966 Venus made a Trine to the MC.
Venus rules the natal MC.
This is powerful.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - By pass Surgery

Health : Medical procedure 1980 (Triple by-pass surgery)

Solar Return Ascendant in 1980 came to natal 6th (in Gemini).
The Sun - Saturn opposition in natal came almost identically in this Solar Return as in natal position.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Gianni Agnelli - Hyleg and Alcocoden?

Death by Disease 24 January 2003 (died at age 81, prostate cancer).

Well, I realized something important while I have calculating the H&A.
Hyleg is the Moon in 4th (Bonatti says Moon angular and in masculine sign in Male chart is appropriate for Hyleg), Alcocoden is Mars in 4th in Aries.
This Mars would give its highest years - 66.
Cauda Draconis in 12 degrees near Mars would take 1/3 of the years, that is 5 years.
We have 61 years.
But he lived 81 years?!
Remember in the last post we delineate his Triple By Pass surgery in 1980. This is near the years which Alcocoden gave.
The modern day medicine and his financial support for this had helped prolonging his life.
This is what the medieval people did not have, and this is why it is very hard in these days to calculate the Alcocoden and the years of death acording to the Alcododen.

 

[JUPITERASC]

Re: Gianni Agnelli - Hyleg and Alcocoden?

Death by Disease 24 January 2003 (died at age 81, prostate cancer).

Well, I realized something important while I have calculating the H&A.
Hyleg is the Moon in 4th (Bonatti says Moon angular and in masculine sign in Male chart is appropriate for Hyleg), Alcocoden is Mars in 4th in Aries.
This Mars would give its highest years - 66.
Cauda Draconis in 12 degrees near Mars would take 1/3 of the years, that is 5 years.
We have 61 years.
But he lived 81 years?!
Remember in the last post we delineate his Triple By Pass surgery in 1980. This is near the years which Alcocoden gave.
The modern day medicine and his financial support for this had helped prolonging his life.
This is what the medieval people did not have, and this is why it is very hard in these days to calculate the Alcocoden and the years of death according to the Alcocoden.

Perhaps so Omnisphericus... and many thanks for all your valuable contributions to our traditional thread on this forum

Nevertheless - the thought occurs to me that, for all the billions who have limited access to modern day medicine and who lack the financial support, presumably the Alcocoden remains an effective marker for what dr. farr refers to as "the critical years" of the life when IF THERE IS NO MEANS OF INTERVENTION then death is a distinct possibility

 

[Omnisphericus]

Re: Gianni Agnelli - Hyleg and Alcocoden?

Nevertheless - the thought occurs to me that, for all the billions who have limited access to modern day medicine and who lack the financial support, presumably the Alcocoden remains an effective marker for what dr. farr refers to as "the critical years" of the life when IF THERE IS NO MEANS OF INTERVENTION then death is a distinct possibility

Yes, I agree. Also, I think that in many cases there is predestined time of death and this is inescapable. This is often showed by some very awful direction to the life giving places in the chart.

 

[JUPITERASC]

Re: Gianni Agnelli - Hyleg and Alcocoden?

Yes, I agree. Also, I think that in many cases there is predestined time of death and this is inescapable. This is often showed by some very awful direction to the life giving places in the chart.

Death is indeed inescapable in any event HOWEVER to paraphrase the old saying: "everyone wants to go to Heaven BUT no-one wants to experience death in order to get there!"

 

[Omnisphericus]

Elisabeth, Empress of Austria

Events

Relationship : Marriage 24 April 1854 (Cousin, Franz Josef)
Family : Change in family responsibilities 21 August 1858 (Crown prince born)
Death of Child 30 January 1889 (Son a suicide)
Death by Homicide 10 September 1898 (Stabbed, age 60)

Biography

German royalty, the second daughter of Duke Joseph of Bavaria. After a happy childhood, raised in a rural family castle, she became the Empress of Austria and Hungary with her marriage to her cousin Franz Josef on 4/24/1854 when she was 17. Coming from an unrestrained background into the ceremonies of the Vienna court, her marriage suffered not only from the necessary adjustments but from the stress of a nagging mother-in-law. The marriage began as a glowing love-match, but gradually turned cold when her husband began to pursue casual infidelities.
Elizabeth had three children who were raised by Franz Josef's mother; she was allowed very little contact with them, and the first daughter died in infancy. After their third child was born, Crown Prince Rudolph, she became estranged from her husband. Seeming to suffer from poor health, she sought relief and recuperation in a great deal of travel.
A striking beauty with a gay spirit, Elizabeth was an accomplished horsewoman. Her ability to speak Magyar fluently endeared her to the Hungarians. Though her judgment was sound, she took little part in public affairs and abhorred publicity, preferring a quiet interest in literature. In 1881 her son, Archduke Rudolph, married Princess Stephanie, but it was not a close union.
When the country began a disastrous war with Prussia and Italy in 1866, Elizabeth rejoined her husband, helping to bring better relations between Austria and Hungary, halves of the dual monarchy.
Europe was shocked with the scandal when Archduke Rudolph committed suicide with Baroness Maria Vetsera at Mayerling 1/30/1889, 7:00 to 8:00 AM. Family trauma was not unfamiliar to the Empress; her cousin had been a suicide and her sister died in a fire in 1897.
Elizabeth fell deeply into melancholia. Seeking escape again in travel, as the left the hotel to board a ship, she was stabbed to death by Italian anarchist Luigi Luccheni the afternoon of 9/10/1898, Bei Genf, Switzerland.

From astrodatabank

 

[Omnisphericus]

Empress Elisabeth Abu Ali's Considerations

Jupiter in 1st
Cauda Draconis in 2nd
Saturn and Moon in 3rd
Sun in 4th
Mars and mercury in 5th
Venus in 6th

Juptier in 1st:
"Signifies honor. glory, humility, respect, wisdom and peaceful life".

Saturn in 3rd:
"Indicates hatered and conflicts between the siblings."

Moon in 3rd:
"Signifies professional duties and joy from reach people, kings, noblemans and foreigners. Journeys."

Sun in 4th:
"Indicates wealth under the earth, revealing of the secrets and hidden things.
Honor and fame. Arts."

Mars in 5th:
"Indicates many illegal children and no joy from them"

Mercury in 5th:
"Indicates a lot of work through latters. Many joy from one of the sons".
(This would be so if Mars was not here, maybe?!)

Venus in 6th:
"Signifies lustful women, illnesses transmitted through women, as thefts from servants"


Cauda Draconis in 2nd signifies decline of the status.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Empress Elisabeth - Delineation of Natal Chart

Ascendant in earth sign, the person would seek Material Security, through Pleasures, Children and Art (Creativity) or Literature (Mercury in 5th).

The native benefits from the land and inheritance, from the family (Ruler of 4th in 1st).
There is contention between the native and family (ruler of 12th in 4th).

Ruler of 6th in 3rd shows bad stuffs to the kin (because the planet is Saturn).

Children have dificult life and early death (Ruler of 8th in 5th).

Native travels because of Service (ruler of 9th in 6th).

Native gains advantage through her kin (ruler of 11th in 3rd). Her husband is her kin.

Where do the native gains enemies? In her own land and into her parents. (Ruler of 12th in 4th).

 

[Omnisphericus]

Empress Elisabeth - Marriage

Relationship : Marriage 24 April 1854 (Cousin, Franz Josef)

Venus is Almuten of 7th.
In April 1854 (16 years old) she was in Saturn/Venus Firdaria.
Saturn is in 3rd = Kher husband is her Kin.

In December 1853 Profected Ascendant came on natal 5th house (Capricorn).
Sun is in Capricorn. Saturn is Lord of the Year.
Profecting by month, in April we come to the 9th house (Taurus) and the Lord of the Month was Venus.

The Solar Return for 1853/1854 is having Leo for Ascendant and Venus exactly in DC.
Sun is in 5th house in that Solar Return conjuncting Jupiter.
In April, directed SR Ascendant came to 5th house.
Saturn, ruler of SR DC is in 10th showing public marriage and person with high social status.
Venus on DC in SR rules the 3rd in SR. (The husband is the kin).
Isn't it amazing to see how is this all conected?!

 

[Omnisphericus]

Elizabeth Empress - Death of the Son

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kZwRmUJUBU
Watching this video and listening to this song one can actually feel the presence of the sad life the Empress had.

Her Son committed suicide when 30 years old.
Ruler of 8th in 5th (Mars) is the significator of the young death of her child.
That Mars is having honors in 5th, also rules the third.

The profections in December of 1888 came to her 4th house Sag.
Mars falls in the sign of Aries (natal 8th house).Actually that Mars was profected to the 8th house of natal.
The suicide happened in the 2nd month from her birthday (i.e. January 1889).
Profected Ascendant came to the second house, i.e. Capricorn - ruler is Saturn.
Saturn is ruler of natal 5th where Mars is in Capricorn.
The Firdaria is Sun/Saturn.

Saturn and Capricorn, is also ruler of the SR Ascendant in that year.

 

[Omnisphericus]

Some Basic Delineation Rules

I rely on the Ben Dykes explanation in his book "Using Medieval Astrology".

Planet in a certain house has many topics in hand.

1. First, that planet will act always according to its Essential Nature. Malefic will act by impeding, Benefic will act by increasing the good.

2. The Planet will bring with it self the Agenda of the houses she rules.
If a planet is in 11th, and ruling 4th, we can say that the Parents (or Father particularly) are native's Friends.

When you see a planet in certain house you should ask the following 4 questions (by the planet ruling some other house):

a) Who is experiencing the affairs of the house?
b) Why the houses affairs are manifesting or what has led to them?
c) What sorts of things the house's affairs are responsible for?
d) What the house's affairs are like?


1st House
Planets in 1st house are giving their own tone to the whole character and being to the native's character and body shape.
Mercury will show intelligent person. Venus love for fun. Sun Glory. Jupiter Wisdom and Philosophy. Moon changeability. Saturn melancholy. Mars passions and furiousity when in best, anger and destruction when in worst.

The planets by ruling some other house also shows What Comes to the Native's Experience. Ruler of 2nd in 1st shows that Money comes to the Native. Ruler of 3rd in 1st shows that the native has authority over the kin and siblings, over parents and family (4th), over the children (5th), over the servants (6th), over the partner (7th), over the partner's financies (8th), over the journeys (9th), in work (10th), over the friends (11th), over the enemies (12th).
10th in 1st also shows that honors are bestowed to the native. 11th in 1st shows that native gains Acquisitions.

The Ruler of 1st in house is showing in which field the native will seek to fulfill his Primary Motivation:
Ruler of 1st in 2nd - Through Acquiring Wealth.
1st in 3rd - Through Reading, Short Journeys and Communication skills.
1st in 4th - In the home, or through Family. Through the relationship with the Father.
1st in 5th - Through Children; joyful entertainment and gambling (in worse).
1st in 6th - through aquaring professional skills (6th is related with 10th by triplicity), through being of Service.
1st in 7th - Through Partnership.
1st in 8th - going through the hardships of life.
1st in 9th - through long journeys and philosophy.
1st in 10th - through the career and work.
1st in 11th - through friendships and hopes and wishes. Through Groups.
1st in 12th - Through Self-Undoing.

The ruler of 1st in houses is also showing the physical body's health.
Ruler of 1st in 6th/8th and 12th can show poor health.
The ruler of 1st in Houses can also shows the nature of the Life of the Native.
Ruler of 1st in 8th shows that the native has difficult life. In 11th - Fortunate. In 5th - Happy. In 6th - he is servant. In 12th - Troubled life.
Ruler of 1st in houses also shows what the native enjoys.
Ruler of 1st in 9th indicates that the native enjoys journeys and philosophy, or religion. Ruler of 1st in 5th - the native enjoys being with kids or being a performer, being creative and etc. Ruler of 1st in 6th shows that the native enjoys to be of service and to apply its professional skills.
Ruler of 1st in houses also shows what the native encounters in life.
Ruler of 1st in 12th shows that the native encounters secret enemies, in 7th - opposition and obstruction. In 8th - early death (if there are no benefics around and the sign is of malefic type, i.e. the malefic is ruling it).

 

[Omnisphericus]

Re: Delineating Natal Chart 2nd House

2nd House is movable possessions of which the Money are the greatest representative.
the house position of the Lord of 2nd often shows the area of life which produces the money income for the native.

Lord of 3rd in 2nd shows that native's money are related to the kin and siblings.
Lord of 4th in 2nd: income from parents and inheritance.
Lord of 5th in 2nd: income from children, art, creativity, performance.
Lord of 6th in 2nd: through servants, servitude, professional skills.
Lord of 7th in 2nd: through the partner, the opponents are responsible for money income or decrease.
Lord of 8th in 2n: partner's money are native's money.
Lord of 9th in 2nd: through journeys and philosophy.
Lord of 10th in 2nd: through career and work, through honors.
Lord of 11th in 2nd: through Friends and Groups.
Lord of 12th in 2nd: through hospitalizations, prisons and secret things.

Lord of 2nd in 1st shows that money comes to the native easily.
Lord of 2nd in 2nd: - II -(same. Or, from the death of the partner (2nd is 8th from 7th in derived houses).
Lord of 2nd in 3rd: native gains profit through the kin and siblings. Through writing, traveling on short journeys, and through communication.
Lord of 2nd in 4th: Native gain's or loses (money) profit through family, inheritance, immovable properties, lands and etc.. or, money goes to the parents.
Lord of 2nd in 5th: through children, gambling, creativity, art, performing.
Lord of 2nd in 6th: money through applying the professional skills, through servitude, or money goes to the servants.
Lord of 2nd in 7th: money goes to the native's partner or opponents. Native gains through partnership or through the spouse.
Lord of 2nd in 8th: the native's partner gains from his death. The native uses the partner's money.
Lord of 2nd in 9th: native is spending money on long journeys and philosophy. Money through journeys and philosophy.
Lord od 2nd in 10th: native spents money on career. His work and career brings him money.
Lord of 2nd in 11th: native gives money to the friends, friends are using the native's money. Native gains through friendships and organizations.
Lord of 2nd in 12th: Native gives money to hospitals, prisons, secret societies and etc..

 

[Omnisphericus]

Ruler of 1st in 4th. The native's primary motivation is to seek emotional security in Father, or in Home (through parents).
Exaltation ruler of 1st in 6th = through philosophy (Jupiter), acquiring knowledge and skills (Mercury and Jupiter in 6th). Through being of service and applying his professional skills.

Ruler of 2nd in 7th, money come through business partnerships, but because Sun is in square with Mars, this is often very troubled for the native.
Exalted ruler of 2nd is in 5th = Money comes through Creativity, Art and performance.
Ruler of 3rd in 6th = Native's brother is of Mercurial type and is applying the professional skills - he is a coach - he is of service.
Ruler of 4th in 6th = parents are servants (they are low class workers).
Ruler of 10th in 4th = honors comes to the native (because it is an angle), but because this is mars, it is not so easily acquaried. The work is in the Home.
Ruler of 5th in 4th = native is having fun at home, he enjoys being home, with the family.
Ruler of 6th in 6th = native's illnesses are weak and his health is of good state. Good developed skills and servitude.
Ruler of 7th in 5th = Partner is young and fun. Partner is performer.
Ruler of 8th in 5th = Native's children are having dificult life? They die young?
Ruler of 9th in 6th = Illness when on Journeys? Native's Skills and servitude benefits from Journeys and Philosophy. Philosophy and Religion helps the native's skills.
Native's journeys because of service and applying the professional skills.
Servants are people of esteem. The skills and servitude are of esteem.
Ruler of 10th in 4th: honor is gained because of the father. Honors are bestowed to the native.
Ruler of 11th in 6th = Friends are servants. Servants are having friends, hopes and wishes. Friends benefit from his service and skills.
Native gains advantage through his skills and service.

Ruler of 12th in 6th:
Native's service (and skills) suffers loss and troubles.
Native finds enemies, loss and contention in the service, in applying the skills,

 

[Omnisphericus]

Marvin Gay

Events

Work : Contracts, agreements 1961 (Signed with Motown)
Relationship : Marriage 1961 (Anna)
Work : Published/ Exhibited/ Released 1962 ("Stubborn Kind of Fellow")
Work : Published/ Exhibited/ Released 1965 ("How Sweet It Is (To Be Loved By You)")
Death of Significant person 16 March 1970 (Tammi Terrell)
Work : Published/ Exhibited/ Released 1973 ("Let's Get It On")
Relationship : Divorce dates 1975 (From Anna)
Family : Change residence 1981 (Fled to Europe)
Death by Homicide 1 April 1984 at 12:00 noon in Los Angeles, CA (Shot by father, age 44)

Additional information to the Events:

In 1975, Gaye’s divorce from Anna was nasty, keeping him in divorce courts much of the time. He was hit heavily by missed alimony payments in 1976. He remarried in the late ‘70s but his escalating drug problems doomed the union. He relocated to Hawaii for a while to sort out his personal affairs.

Returning to the U.S., Gaye moved in with his parents as he tried to come to terms with drug addiction. The return home only sent him into a spiral of depression, quarrels with his dad and threats of suicide. Finally, on 4/01/1984,
he was shot and killed by his father the day before his 45th birthday, Los Angeles, CA.