How does Astrology work?

[rahu]

dear reality.
i think you trying to judge astrology by standards that you don't even judge science.you own prejudice to science and the causal theory,has made you unable to be impartial.
the casual mode descibes natural phenonoma but does not explain it.science doe not know what electricity is but they can predict it behavior.science does not know what gravity is,but the can predict it behavior.cosmologist mow believe up to 90% of the mass and energy of the universe is missing.they don't even know what this missing dark matter and energy is made up,yet through causal deductions they know it is missing.
i could go on with more examples how the causal mode can describe but not explain,but i don't think your open to examining your own fundenmental fallacies.
rahu

 

[Futurist]

Here's my 'take' on this subject/thread. Here is a reprint of an article I wrote for a magazine that, coincidentally had the teaser... If I had a dollar for every time someone has asked me 'How does astrology work?'...This is how.

Obviously this is not a definitive explanation so that should properly read' This is how I believe it works' but it does concurs with one of the previous replies that it's all to do with synchronisation.

Entrainment

One of the laws upon which the Hermetic principles of astrology are based is, The Law Of Vibration.

Nothing rests; everything moves; everything vibrates - The Kybalion

This is possibly the most important law because it contains an explanation as to how everything in the universe, animate or inanimate, can be connected to each other.

As modern science endorses, everything in the universe is comprised of a swirling mass of energy. The density of these packets of energy and the speed of vibration of their component atoms and molecules, along with environmental forces, decide whether we observe an amorphous mass or a solid object. What also affects what we observe is us - the observer. The rate that our component parts oscillate have an effect on what we see.

The Hermetic teachings go much further than modern science has yet dared to venture. They teach that not only is all matter vibrating but that all emotions are a manifestation of vibration. Thus all thought, reason, emotion, will or desire are accompanied by vibratory rates, which may be lowered or raised at will by adepts.

In the same way that the vibration of a musical note can affect the atoms and molecules in a mirror and cause it to shatter, so it is postulated that man may affect the minds of others. If his thought processes are vibrating at a certain level then, through a well known phenomenon called resonance, it is possible for both minds to become 'entrained' or synchronised. This is often commented on in daily life when two people refer to each other as being 'on the same wavelength', or liking (or disliking) someone's 'vibes'.

According to Dr Percy Seymour, a Theoretical Astrophysicist, resonance is what makes it possible for a radio telescope to tune into specific vibrations in the Andromeda Galaxy (14 million, million, million miles away) and accounts for the Solar System playing a symphony of vibrations on the magnetic field of the Earth. It also foils the arguments of all those who believe that planetary forces beyond the Moon are too weak to have any impact on terrestrial life. Resonant Theory states that even small fluctuating forces can have large consequences, if the frequency of vibration coincides. This supports the main tenet of astrology, which is that personalities of individuals are related to the state of the Solar System at the time of birth*

Dr Seymour believes that the resonance between the tidal tug (due to gravity), of the very hot gases trapped in the magnetic field of the Sun and Earth, and resonance between the resulting fluctuations of the Earth's magnetic field and the electrical activity of the neural network in the brain, are what link celestial firmly to terrestrial.

Basically Dr Seymour confirms the theory of harmonics put forward by John Addey in 1975: All astrological effects can be understood in terms of the harmonics of cosmic periods. This frees astrology from its somewhat limiting twelve-fold straightjacket and allows us to understand how new planets can be discovered without changing the fundamental basis of astrological thought and practice. Resonant theory (harmonics) is the Holy Grail for astrologers because there is no astrological doctrine in classical or modern astrology which cannot be explained by it.

It also explains why we attract certain events, or people, to us who reflect the state of our consciousness. Thus, when we are angry we are more likely to attract the violence or car accident which we are resonating with. More positively, it is the explanation for miraculous events in that we 'entrain' ourselves to good unfolding when our thoughts are constantly kept at the higher vibration, or frequency, of love and happy outcomes.

Each planet and star in the Cosmos possesses its own vibratory frequency. Every object and every word spoken also has its own signature vibratory frequency, as does every living thing. Mars vibrates to a frequency similar to the number 16 -which in turn vibrates to the colour of crimson; which vibrates to Iron; which vibrates to the gem Ruby; which vibrates to the musical tone C Major, which vibrates to the flower hollyhock etc., etc. This is the basis of the astrological principle of correspondence.

I believe that vibrations will one day prove to be the invisible threads which weave the fabric of life together. Resonant Theory, as Dr Seymour has discovered, explains many terrestrial phenomena including why astrology should not be dismissed as ' for entertainment value only'. I leave the last words to Dr Seymour:

"The claims made by many scientists that astrology is opposed to the basic principles of western science comes from a total misunderstanding of serious astrology, and an apalling lapse in their understanding of the methodology, philosophy and history of science itself."

*Dr Percy Seymour. The Scientific Basis of Astrology ISBN 0-572-02181-x

 

[Reality]

And I'm not having a discussion, I am mocking you. You come here convinced of your self-righteousness, questioning a believe I live by, yet which I test for myself every step of the way.

You refuse to discuss your idea's with me, as you admit now, but I'm the one who's convinced of my self-righteousness?

That gives you the autority to say that science has all the answers? It doesn't, never had, and never will.

Have I ever claimed that science answers all our questions? I do think astrology does not answer our questions, but that doesn't mean that scientific method can (partly because a large part of people's questions aren't answerable in the first place).

And to answer (or not answer) Reality's original question: it is enough to know that astrology works.

Then how are you sure astrology works? Have you ever seen a reliable confirmation of it, in terms of repeated indirect polls to check a claim from astrology? Claiming to know something is very far-going, and I really wonder whether you can back it up.

dear reality.
i think you trying to judge astrology by standards that you don't even judge science.

To start with, Unukalhai challenged me to employ the 'analytical extreme of science', as he thinks it acknowledges astrology. But in general I do judge science with very strict standards, as every researcher learns to do at university. If a hypothesis is in any way logical or explains a clear and observable fact then I'm willing to grant it some credit, but in the case of astrology I haven't seen either of them. A lot of people don't realise how rigouresly scientific hypotheses are tested before being granted any credit, they think any seemingly logical idea can be called a theory.

science doe not know what electricity is but they can predict it behavior.science does not know what gravity is,but the can predict it behavior.cosmologist mow believe up to 90% of the mass and energy of the universe is missing.they don't even know what this missing dark matter and energy is made up,yet through causal deductions they know it is missing.

The examples you mention are all uncomparable to astrology. It's true that we can't observe the phenomenons you mention, but some aspects of them we can observe and predict succesfully. If you put a current on a lightbulb it will create light; you can do this a hundred times with different lightbulbs, but it still works. The same thing goes for gravity, we can calculate gravity with formula's deducted from existing theory and see that it gives a correct outcome. Dark matter is harder to predict, just as it was hard to predict gravity when we first started to understand it, but I think this too will become clearer as research advances.
The reason why I say this is all uncomparable to astrology is that astrology isn't based on solid observations (or please show me the opposite). We don't know why it would work and we don't know it works in the first place, as the latter requires rigourous statistical research. Scientists aren't willing to do this research because astrology doesn't qualify as a usable scientific hypothesis, so the burden of proof goes to the astrologists.

Futurist, some quotes from your article:

The Hermetic teachings go much further than modern science has yet dared to venture. They teach that not only is all matter vibrating but that all emotions are a manifestation of vibration. Thus all thought, reason, emotion, will or desire are accompanied by vibratory rates, which may be lowered or raised at will by adepts.

How does the author know that "emotions are a manifestation of vibration", what does he base that claim on? Can he observe this 'vibration', or is this 'vibration' necessary to explain another observed phenomenon? Otherwise this is an empty claim.

Resonant Theory states that even small fluctuating forces can have large consequences, if the frequency of vibration coincides. This supports the main tenet of astrology, which is that personalities of individuals are related to the state of the Solar System at the time of birth

The idea that small forces can become stronger by resonance does not support the idea that "personalities are relatied to the state of the Solar System": resonance strengthens a physical force, but nobody has proven that a physical force can influence personality. That's a whole different claim, one which is entire outside the idea of resonance. Before the latter relation is proven, physical resonance does not in any way support astrology.

Dr Seymour believes that the resonance between the tidal tug (due to gravity), of the very hot gases trapped in the magnetic field of the Sun and Earth, and resonance between the resulting fluctuations of the Earth's magnetic field and the electrical activity of the neural network in the brain, are what link celestial firmly to terrestrial.

Hehe Does this 'docter' Seymour back this up with observations? It's hard to measure electric activity in the brain in the first place, but apparently he has found a way (EEG and MRI only give a very rough picture of what's going on in the brain). Obviously this claim can't be made without having such data, otherwise it's the wildest guess ever.

 

[rahu]

issac newton who is usually considered the greatest scientific mind before einstein was a astrologer.so you are inferring that this mathematical genius could not ascertain for himself the validity of astrology.you have no intention of having a dialogue here you are only ranting.you remind me more of a creationist that a scientist.oh and at least give astrology a little credit,it allows creationists and scientists to agree on one point.it is ironic that alchemist and astrologer gave birth to modern science and primordial religions,yet the mother is rejected by her children.
rahu

 

[PYXIS]

I've heard it time and time again...these people who think 'science' has all the answers...
Little do they realize just how limited and stagnant true science is....it's very 3rd dimensional....if it cannot be proven scientifically...it doesn't work.
The cosmos are conscious...and this is how it works...and I might add..much more awakened than us.

 

[Reality]

issac newton who is usually considered the greatest scientific mind before einstein was a astrologer.so you are inferring that this mathematical genius could not ascertain for himself the validity of astrology.you have no intention of having a dialogue here you are only ranting.you remind me more of a creationist that a scientist.oh and at least give astrology a little credit,it allows creationists and scientists to agree on one point.it is ironic that alchemist and astrologer gave birth to modern science and primordial religions,yet the mother is rejected by her children.
rahu

Newton was a genius at math, but that doesn't mean he really understanded science in a modern way. Don't forget that Newton lived in a different world then we do, so many things were still unknown back then. By now we start to understand such elusive concepts as 'personality', but back then people didn't even have a clue how a brain functions. Newton should have accepted that he didn't understand such things, but instead he allowed his imagination to fill the void.
Quoting 'authority figures' is a much used trick in debating, but it doesn't work on me. Even such people as Newton and Einstein could've had unscientific illusions beside their own field of specialisation, they're still people.

I've heard it time and time again...these people who think 'science' has all the answers...
Little do they realize just how limited and stagnant true science is....it's very 3rd dimensional....if it cannot be proven scientifically...it doesn't work.
The cosmos are conscious...and this is how it works...and I might add..much more awakened than us.

Pyxis you haven't read my post at all. I've allready declared that I do not think science has all answers, while I do think it's the only thing that has any answers.
Things can work before we understand them, but until then we can't say we know they work. If you say that the cosmos is conscious then I simply ask you how you know that, as I'm sure you can't back up that claim in any way.

I've been called 'over-confident' and 'closed minded' on this forum, but it seems I'm the only one who actually reads the others posts and thinks about the others arguments. That's a big disappointment to me. I didn't expect agreement, but I did expect a serious discussion.
I'm a regular user of a science forum, and there we often get religious guests who try to challenge our scientific way of thinking. Ofcourse most of us don't agree with them, but we do read their arguments and try to explain why they aren't logical.

Let me finish by rephrasing a quote of Sokrates: True wisdom lies in knowing what you don't know.
If you really want to learn something new, ask people "how do you know that?". There's wonderful knowledge out there, but until you start asking this question you wont be able to see it.

 

[Arian Maverick]

Although I understand that most individuals do not consider channeling to be a veritable scientific source, I thought you may be interested in visiting a thread I created many months ago titled Kryon Astrology Channelings, especially this excerpt from Astrology - the way it works scientifically:

17) QUESTION: Dear Kryon, we’ve been studying astrology for some time and we know that the solar system helps to create and support an impression of an individual selfhood for us. The planets and their movements affect our character, moods, and ideas. We’d like to know what exactly this mechanism does and how this system works in terms of science. Most important, we’d like to know how we could use this ancient science most effectively in the new energy. It seems to be a contract, “karma.” What happens when one enlightens and cancels his contract? Do the planets then stop affecting us?

ANSWER: Although this has been explained in recent channellings, we’ll summarize the way astrology works: The sun is the fulcrum of the solar system and the center of energy for life for you. There is a physical mechanism for the sending of information from the sun to the other planets and it’s called the solar wind. This energy stream carries with it whatever pattern of interdimensional energy the sun has at that moment, and delivers it to whatever is in reach of the sun's magnetic field [the Helios]. It’s always there, but it has cycles of intensity. Although science sees the solar wind as a energy player in the solar system, they have yet to see the interdimensional patterns it carries to the planets as this wind blasts out from the sun.

These patterns reflect the posturing of the sun as the other planets exhibit their tugs and pulls on it via gravity and magnetics (both are interdimensional energies). Therefore these sun patterns change continuously as the planets provide new gravitational and magnetic situations to the sun.

When the solar wind, carrying this sun pattern, hits the Earth, it deposits the pattern upon the magnetic grid. The magnetic grid is dynamic (changes all the time), and is responsive to being constantly repatterned. The grid lines of the planet alter the pattern slightly due to fact that your grids aren’t consistent and have greater and lesser areas of influence in different Earth locations.

Human DNA is sensitive to magnetics, since it is a magnetic engine itself. At birth, when the child is separated from the parent, there is a signal sent to the brain of the infant that says, “Your system is now active and on its own, apart from your mother.” During that first breath of independent and unique life, the child’s DNA receives the pattern from the magnetics of the Earth’s grid, and takes on what you have come to call “astrological attributes.”

Different places on the planet will carry the basic pattern, plus or minus what Earth’s magnetic field has contributed due to geographic location. This explains why world-class astrology must take into consideration the location of birth. Astocartography is also based on this principle.

Astrology is the oldest science on the planet, and can be proven to be accurate. In addition, “generic” astrology is also a significant influence in Humanism, from the cycles of the female’s system, to the profound changes in Human behavior when the moon in full. You can’t separate yourself from it, and those who don’t believe in it might as well not believe in breathing, because it’s that much of an influence on your life.

The new energy on the planet invites you to change your DNA. This is the teaching of Kryon. When you change your DNA, you’re working with the very core of the pattern you had at birth, and so you’re able to then work on some of the attributes of your astrological blueprint, and actually change it—even neutralize it. We told you all about that in 1989. Masters did this, and you’re now coming into a time where your abilities are those of the masters. Look into your life and eliminate the things that are challenges and keep the attributes that support you. This is the true balanced Human Being.

You can change your sensitivity to attributes within your own individual astrology type, but the generic influences of the planets’ and moon’s movements will always affect you to some degree, since you’re not an island apart from others. These would be things such as retrogrades and the moon’s influence (as indicated). You might say, “I’m no longer affected by retrogrades” and sit and smile all you want. Meanwhile, you still shouldn’t sign contracts during that time, since all those around you are still affected. Think about it.

Arian Maverick

 

[pwadm]

There are 4 fundamental forces in the Universe as stated in modern physics - electromagnetism, gravitation, weak and strong nuclear forces. Astrology isn't explained by any of them. So allegedly astrology cannot be true.

Unless there are some other forces at work.

To date, the human mind functioning is the most misunderstood of all fields of knowledge. To me this is natural, you cannot fully understand a system unless you are able to see it from all sides, to see all parts of it. Can you do that with the human mind? We, with our minds, try to understand the human mind. It's like an observer enclosed in a box trying to understand all about the box. He can't do it. He needs to get out of the box for that. Impossible to do that with the human mind. So, using science,a 100% intellectual approach, one will never understand the truth on the human mind.

Unless... you switch perspective. You go for spiritual values, for a spiritual perspective. Are spiritual, cultural values scientific? Nobody claims that. These are well beyond science.

Astrology obviously has a direct effect on the human mind, on the emotions, on the subconscious, on the spiritual side of people AND of the Universe.

A scientific approach to any subject requires the use of appropriate methods and tools in order to measure the characteristics of an object, energy, condition. Would one use a thermometer in order to determine the dimensions of an object? Obviously not.

Then, Reality, you're wasting your time trying to investigate Astrology by what you call science. You need to go beyond current science to understand that.