5th house in Scorpio… what lesson am I supposed to learn?

[Tryalchemy]

So I’ve got a Scorpio 5th house with a
Pluto(9deg)-Mercury(11deg)-Venus(12deg) conjunction and Saturn at the end, not aspecting these planets. Saturn aspects no planets in my chart actually. Literally the day transiting Saturn began squaring my natal Saturn, I’ve had difficulties almost identical to those that popped up during my Saturn return. My 7th is Capricorn, btw. So what exactly is the lesson here that Saturn is trying to teach me? Am I making the same mistake I made during my Saturn return? My intuition is on point and I really thought my decisions were correct this time, but if they are correct, then why the sudden obstacles and challenges? For a while, it seemed as though circumstances were working in my favor and I was being rewarded. But since the transiting square began, it’s turned into a real circus. Is this a test to see if I just give up? Is it a test to see if I blindly remain patient for what ultimately amounts to nothing? Does it have to do with my ego or insecurities I still need to work through? I have mastered the whole “patience” and “discipline” practice, and sure, it’s a wonderful adult behavior to master, but I’ve become quite jaded and my patience has turned to indifference and eventually resentment. It’s taxing to be expected to sloth through year after year with poise and empathy like a saint no matter what obstacles are put in my path. And I no longer have my overly agressive 4th house Mars to give me the energy to get back up over and over…Mars became extremely self controlled after the age of 30. So I might seem patient, but really all I’m doing is surrendering to what appears to be a predestined purgatory of what is simply not attainable.

 

[IleneK]

I do not want to be intrusive but if okay with you, would you want to post your chart?

 

[Tryalchemy]

 

[waybread]

In both a Saturn return and transiting Saturn square natal Saturn, you've got Saturn and Saturn. Saturn runs a diagnostic on our lives, sort of like a mechanic checking out a vehicle for a periodic check-up. When Saturn tests Saturn, it's kind of like the dealership mechanic getting tested and recertified by the manufacturer, to ensure that s/he is up on the technology.

Generally the Saturn return is a time of maturation. Those youthful years are left behind as one enters middle age. This transition may carry real life events with it. Someone gets married. If married, s/he has a first child. Maybe there's a career development. Probably the worst way to take a Saturn return is an inertia that sticks with the past, vs taking serious steps forward.

Then transiting Saturn keeps on going. The first separating square tests how well those Saturn return decisions went for you. If you feel your Saturn return didn't go so well for you, transiting Saturn now is kind of rubbing your face in it, but with the idea that now is a good time to make those important changes. Better late than never. You'll be tested again during the Saturn opposition and applying square, so it's best to put in some course corrections now.

I don't know what changes you implemented during your Saturn return. But it seems that now, you are falling back on a fatalistic, deterministic view of your Saturn square. Maybe it's Libra seeing both sides of an issue, with the default position of stasis. What does it mean? What should you do?? You get to decide.

Saturn in your 9th house makes me wonder if your tests have to do with higher education, living or traveling overseas, or really, anything that has to do with expanding your mental horizons.

Saturn is in your 5th house but it is so close to the cusp of your 6th house that many astrologers would read it as in the 6th house of work and service. If you're not currently giving back to your community (or clients, depending on your line of work) this would be a good time to start.

This is a good time to itemize what is really frustrating you now, and what you would like your life to look like. Maybe develop a 5-year plan for yourself to get out of your present hole. Mars-moon will tend towards impatience, but I suggest a multi-year plan to direct your energy and feelings.

Good luck with this.

 

[Tryalchemy]

During my Saturn return many people vanished from my life, so I was forced to move on regardless. It took a while but I eventually pulled myself out of depression and became sort of focused on working towards things my chart permitted me to have. I stopped allowing people to dictate my life or disrespect me, and I stopped allowing my father’s narcissistic behavior to have any impact on me - in fact, I took his control away just by realizing he can demand and belittle me as much as he wants but it’s up to me to respond, which I don’t, so really, i’m the one with the control. But my biggest lesson from Saturn was that I no longer allowed myself to have emotional temper tantrums and behave with a lack of self control, which I feel played a major part in the previous dissolution of my other relationships. I stopped acting immediately on my feelings and instead took time to process and then discuss in a mature manner. I also learned a lot about how my ego played a major part in my response to things that triggered me. I became more patient and stopped demanding to have what I want right then and there. I had gotten away with emotional outbursts and theatrical displays of violence and victimisation in all my romantic relationships until meeting a Capricorn during the Saturn return who would have absolutely none of that behavior and taught me a big fat lesson on emotional control. Because I am quite spiritual in nature, with Saturn transiting 9th house, I worry perhaps I am delusional or not seeing the whole truth in order to protect myself in some way. I will always have attraction to occult matters and eccentric spiritual beliefs, and the little hope I have is the only thing that keeps me from reverting to (which you may have picked up on) my tendency toward nihilism. With the Saturn square being in the 9th, I just want to be sure this isn’t a sign that I am letting my hope and spiritual beliefs blind me from reality. It makes me real nervous since the 5th is involved and I don’t want to be delusional in romantic relationships. I am prone to anxiety and overthinking with mercury-Pluto-Venus, so I can never trust myself entirely that I’m seeing things realistically and not through a paranoid or overly positive lens. If i’m supposed to be working on something having to do with the Saturn square in order to not be whipped by Saturn at a later date, I’m not sure what it is. That makes me nervous, as I do not wish to ***** up again and be punished. Does Saturn want me to find proof that my beliefs are valid and realistic maybe? How would I even find proof of that? I don’t think Saturn counts intuition as proof lol.

 

[waybread]

If you were able to learn to control your temper (moon-Mars,) detach from a narcissistic parent, and generally expand your spiritual nature, that is huge. Just looking at key words for what you've described, you seem to have done a lot of 4th house work during your Saturn return.

If you take the principle that every planet, sign, and house has multiple interpretations that are nevertheless consistent with their core meanings, then you have a lot of input into how you want this Saturn square to look. However, it is easier to ride the horse in the direction its going.

The 9th house rules higher education. Would going back to school be beneficial to you in terms of career advancement or a love of a specific subject? The 9th house rules activities that broaden our mental horizons, like overseas travel, religion (in the sense of theology,) philosophy, great literature, and the law as a subject for study.

Do you know how to use an ephemeris? There is a good free one at Astrodienst, at www.astro. com. I would just suggest that you look into it to find when was Saturn transiting at 18 Aquarius, a separating sextile. Did things go better for you then? How so? Then Saturn will make a trine to its natal position roughly 9 or 10 years after the Saturn return, when it hits 18 degrees Aries. That should give you an easier time with Saturn, but it will be based on how well you learn his lessons at earlier dates.

I view Saturn as my wisest planetary teacher. His lessons are hard work, frugality, deferred gratification, and patience. They don't sound like a whole heap of fun, but if you can master these, Saturn normally rewards his pupils later in life.

This is why I suggest developing a realistic plan for the next few years of your life, What would you like to have happen? How can learning Saturn's lessons help you towards your goals? If spirituality is important to you, how would you like to develop spiritually over the next few years? If anxiety is an issue, what specific steps could you take to deal with it? (Not to mention the usual stuff like career.... )

Saturn isn't just somehow "out there" up in the sky. You are all of the planets in your horoscope, so you have something to say about how you manage them.