Arabic Parts I noticed in my chart.

[piercethevale]

My Part of Distress/Ancestors & Relations (Ascendant + Mars - Saturn), is conjunct his Part of Identity at Cancer 10 (the large diamond).

If I didn't know better, I'd think I might be distantly related to this guy... parts that seem vaguely/potentially related to ancestry keep coming up here. Did Joseph of Arimathea actually go to England and build a church there? Because as British as my lineage is, with only 2% Jewish DNA, that is the only way I have that kind of connection to Christ. If his family members wound up in the British Isles after all.

I was a bit stumped as to what the Part of Identity is that you were referring to. I had to look and find what Part of His is in the 10th of Cancer. That is the Part of HIDDEN Identity, and is also known as the Part of Oration. As it is an identity that was hidden from myself, until quite late in life, and is about what I "orate" on about, write about... and as to what Donald Trump appears as like when he speaks to the masses, and was likely a "hidden Identity" to himself... as per what the Sabian Symbols for that Part are relative to myself and Him. Try to keep the titles intact, if you will, please, for the sake of my own sanity, as I did stop and wonder how I had never heard of such a name for any Part before, none that I can presently recall... although there are a good many alternative titles for quite a number of the Parts, and some so obscure, from a singular, and rather dubious, source, or sometimes a rather exceptionally occult source, that I rather had forgotten about those titles not long after I had them listed in the main thread I initiated about Astrological Parts, known and unknown. I know that it is a lot easier to abbreviate stuff, I do it myself when I think I'm assured that others will know what I'm referring to. I will write PoF, for Part of Fortune, for one example. Po Hidden I.d. would work fine, too, now that I think about it. Thanks...

The real beyootch about this new format the forum started using a couple of years ago, is the characters limit that now won't allow me to edit, add to, etc. to those posts of listed Parts. All of them are maxed out. Unless I do what I had to do to my thread about the "birth chart of Jesus[?]", which was turning the initial post into three, [or is it four?] separate posts, with a note at the end of the first post to then skip ahead to those posts now four hundred, or so, posts later on in that thread, all for the reason to restore the image of that natal chart, which was mysteriously missing from the thread after the forum switched to the new format. It used to disappear periodically too, before the change. [Something in Denmark, stinks!] and once again... I'm sounding like a "conspiracy" believing, paranoiac. Yet as the punchline for an old joke said, "Doctor, just because I am paranoid, it doesn't mean that they're not out to get me". I've been banned from the astrodienst forum, within a few weeks of joining it. I apparently caused the shut down of the old MSN astrologers forum, way back in 2008, and a number of folks say that I probably caused the demise of the ACT astrology forum, a forum of members by invitation only, all the worlds most renowned, were invited. I got accepted by asking and presenting a resume. It was a forum to share techniques, as ACT meant "Astrological Convention on Technique." I had twice as many posts, and way more initiated threads, than anyone else. I got run off by Debra Houlding, from the Skyscript forum... she definitely is adverse to Sabian Symbols, and anything about modern astrology in general.
...and then there's my publisher... that's another story, but I've already written about them.
There are an estimated 7000 professional astrologers today in the United States, and God only knows how many in Europe, in South America, and else where, and I know that I've got a reputation, a "known threat" to their livelihood. The great majority of them, anyways.
...so, "Kill the messenger", as the saying goes.

Getting back to your post, here... It does stand to reason, as it is written that Joseph of Arimathea and James, biological half brother of Jesus, took local women for wives, in old Braeton, that it may well have been multiple wives at that, as was often the custom among the Hebrews, in those times. Although just one a piece, could amount to many offspring... and after 2000 years that lineage could be rather wide spread among the British, the Welsh, even the Scots and the Irish, and God only knows where all else after the many hundred of years of British exploration and colonization, It stands to reason that if it is true that bloodline is particularly affected by Astrological forces, and Jesus was affected by everything, and I am too, [so is Clarisse, btw, as she told me] that as I once remarked to my yogi friend, Suryakant, that "It is said that we have free will and that the 'Stars impel and not compel', and Cayce said to remind ourselves of that, yet after studying the Yeshu'a chart for a couple of years, I've found that He was everything the chart indicates he was being influenced by."... and Suryakant remarked, "Well, God put all that in the Heavens for a reason, and when you are so spiritually advance you become one with the will of God, So it makes perfect sense that he was all that." Now, imagine how some folks might feel about that, if they knew of it, and believed it to be true. They might not like the idea of being so influenced.
Just a bit of advice born from conjecture, perhaps from a conspiracy obsessed paranoiac, But, it might be on the better side of caution to keep such personal affairs, family bloodlines and such, to ones' chest, so to speak?

Since I learned of that, I've had a few times since when I thought of Adolf Hitler, and wondered... if He knew...?

 

[piercethevale]

So, there was one really big overlap with the Jesus chart that jumped out at me...

His Part of Self-Sacrifice (Ascendant + Venus - Pluto), is the same my Part of Tragedy/Fatality (Ascendant + Saturn - Sun). Additionally, on the same degree, is my Part of Debate (Ascendant + Mars - Jupiter). It's all happening on the 7th degree of Pisces.



That is by far the most bizarre one out of all that I've seen so far... it actually seems like kind of a puzzle figuring out how the self-sacrifice of Jesus would be something that I, as an individual, might see as a tragedy or something to debate about. I don't want to go into too much detail on this thread, but to sum it up rather crudely in a way few will understand... I have an unprovable belief that Christ was inspired by the example of Socrates, and sought to do for Jewish and Roman society more broadly something very much like what Socrates did for Athenian society long before him. You won't really understand why, unless you're familiar with Plato's theory of forms, the allegory of the cave, and also the trial of Socrates. But if you look at that, and then look back at Christianity, especially at Gnostic Christianity... well, either you see it or you don't.

It is really interesting that Edgar Cayce also believes Gnostic Christianity to be the closest to what Christ originally taught, even though most Christians see it as heresy. I get the feeling I should probably learn more about Cayce, for sure.

His natal Venus is in the 7th of Pisces as well. Check out his natal Mars and what Parts are conjunct there. Both the Part of Rage/War, and the Part of Ideal Love, for two. It does make sense as to the "turn the other cheek" advice he gave. Mars being conj. the Part of Rage...! Wow...! But tempered by the Part of Ideal Love. So, his idea of how to handle someone that needed a bit of "whuppin", got hit with Ideal Love, instead... sounds about right, huh?
BTW, remember that anything other than as to physical ailments Cayce remarked about, all other information came from, "...none but the messenger from the Throne of Grace, itself." Which meant, the angelic and, or, any one of the members of the Great White Brotherhooda, aka the White Lodge, aka the Ascended Masters, of which it was sometimes Saint Germain, when he was needed. That remark about the Gnostic, came from the "Top", from H.Q., the main office, the Executive Office, what ever you wish to call that...
Keep up the good studies, yer doing fine...

 

[leomoon]

Ref: A Cayce study group would be wonderful. If you are interested in having them, [that is if you don't have the same already?] or know of someone else, some organization, library, or group that would. Let me know and I'll ship them to you, or them. They fit in a box about the size of two shoeboxes.

That is VERY nice of you to offer them. I'm in a Study Group that meets every two weeks, so I'll ask the woman if she is interested next time I see them in another week or so. There are others of course in Phoenix and elsewhere (in every State I'm sure) I gave a lot of books away myself, and need to divest myself of even more as I don't have family who is interested.

I (had or still do have) not sure - an envelope and cover letter from the A.R.E. as you do from back in the 70s when they were trying to do things in the Great Pyramid of Egypt. A lady gave it to me knowing of my interest in the Pyramids and Egypt. I think it was Hugh Lynn Cayce's letter speaking of a doctor and his wife who was going to finance the dig. I always had hoped something would come of it while I was still alive, lol.
As far as I am aware (and I've been there 7 or 8 times to Egypt) - as long as Hawass is alive and others who are banning certain people (like R.Schoch) from more serious laser type of study and digging we won't know about the prognosticated "Hall of Records" Cayce claims is there. However according to geologist R. Schoch, he believes it is likely there in a hidden tunnel between the right paw of the Sphinx and the G.Pyramid just as Cayce predicted using the newest type of Japanese owned machinery they have used.

Robert M. Schoch: The Great Sphinx

During the seismic studies we also discovered evidence of a cavity or chamber under the left paw of the Sphinx. For what it is worth, some have suggested to me that this may be a "Hall of Records" (at the time I was not aware of Edgar Cayce's predictions along these lines). Additionally, we found some lesser (and previously known) cavities under and around the Sphinx, and the data also indicates that there may be a tunnel-like feature running the length of the body.

 

[piercethevale]

I don't know much about Plato and Socrates, at least not enough to know much about what I think you're referring to?
You might find the answer that you seek in reading Jeffrey Furst's book, "Edgar Cayce's Story of Jesus", it was first published in 1978. I bought a copy that year, have replaced it a few times [I wore them out] He spoke of why Jesus went to that cross willingly, as he knew that was going to be his destiny when he prayed in the garden at Gethsemane, he was fully aware for 30 incarnations [that's the sum total of how many he had] that he had to atone for something he did... as He was the Adam that is written of in the Bible. He, and Eve too, got everyone kicked out of paradise, and to the ghetto. Earth is the "Devils Playground", it is said. And there have been many sins that have been committed by the innocent, that wouldn't have been committed had everyone been allowed to live in that "gated community", known as Eden. ...that's the way I can best describe what happened. He messed up. the sins He died for on that cross that the church says were your sins, are those that he was partially responsible for you having been so tempted, and committed. If you accept Yeshu'a as your "savior", your sat-guru,.. and guru's in India have been known to take on some of a disciples karma, so as to help that person... if you accept him as that... you cannot sign ever again. Otherwise you've blown it.
It is another one of the problems I find with Churchianity, this aggressive dogma of Hell fire and brimstone, better do it now or be lost for eternity, dogma... You cannot rip the skin from a snake, it must moult it on its own, to borrow an adage. It need not be in the present lifetime...it would be swell if you did and can handle it... but who do you know, or have heard of, that did, or could have, accepted the Nazarene under those conditions and did live a perfectly sin less life for the remainder of their years?
I would guess that you know about as many as I do, or think that I do....
That's a bit too much for most people to know and believe at present...thanks to that Hellfire and Brimstone stuff, most don't even want to dare think about it.

Then there's the story about Lilith...and, Oh Brother.... if you think the account above is a bit too much... then, best not look into that.
Whether it be true or not...

 

[leomoon]

I read Jeffrey Furst book years ago. Thoroughly enjoyed it, he's a great writer. I'm sure I still have the paperback . Yes, I do - but it's all yellowed from age. 400 pages. Also a really must read is Tom Sugrue's "There is a River" the bio of Edgar CAyce.

 

[athenian200]

I was a bit stumped as to what the Part of Identity is that you were referring to. I had to look and find what Part of His is in the 10th of Cancer. That is the Part of HIDDEN Identity, and is also known as the Part of Oration.

Ah, the website I use actually gives the name "Part of Identity" to Ascendant + Saturn - Moon, which means it is yet another name for that part, along with Oration. Still, I have been making an effort to try and use the same part names you do to avoid confusion, but on that one I got mixed up because not only is the name close, but the formula is the same. I should try to be careful to always include the formula just to be safe.

Getting back to your post, here... It does stand to reason, as it is written that Joseph of Arimathea and James, biological half brother of Jesus, took local women for wives, in old Braeton, that it may well have been multiple wives at that, as was often the custom among the Hebrews, in those times. Although just one a piece, could amount to many offspring... and after 2000 years that lineage could be rather wide spread among the British, the Welsh, even the Scots and the Irish, and God only knows where all else after the many hundred of years of British exploration and colonization, It stands to reason that if it is true that bloodline is particularly affected by Astrological forces, and Jesus was affected by everything, and I am too, [so is Clarisse, btw, as she told me] that as I once remarked to my yogi friend, Suryakant, that "It is said that we have free will and that the 'Stars impel and not compel', and Cayce said to remind ourselves of that, yet after studying the Yeshu'a chart for a couple of years, I've found that He was everything the chart indicates he was being influenced by."... and Suryakant remarked, "Well, God put all that in the Heavens for a reason, and when you are so spiritually advance you become one with the will of God, So it makes perfect sense that he was all that." Now, imagine how some folks might feel about that, if they knew of it, and believed it to be true. They might not like the idea of being so influenced.
Just a bit of advice born from conjecture, perhaps from a conspiracy obsessed paranoiac, But, it might be on the better side of caution to keep such personal affairs, family bloodlines and such, to ones' chest, so to speak?

Since I learned of that, I've had a few times since when I thought of Adolf Hitler, and wondered... if He knew...?

Yeah, I think I just got onto the topic because we wound up discussing ancestry in general, and the chart of Jesus. But more generally, the notion that the House of David made it to the British Isles really changes things up. Instead of it appearing weird or random that the British Empire and the United States prospered so much relative to the rest of the world, it would now mean that... God kept his promise to David after all, but no one knows it.

I don't know much about Plato and Socrates, at least not enough to know much about what I think you're referring to?

Well, I almost included it in my post, but I was worried it might sound a bit arrogant or condescending to go into detail assuming you didn't know the story, since I do often get told that it's common cultural knowledge and "everyone knows it anyway."

Like, I already mentioned how Plato's theory of forms and allegory of the cave sort of hints at something very much like what Gnostic Christianity is saying, about the world of the senses being a mere shadow or distortion of a higher truth. But what's even more critical, is considering the death of Socrates, Plato's teacher. He was accused of corrupting the youth with his teachings, and sentenced to death. He had opportunities to escape, but instead he chose to drink the hemlock and die to fulfill the judgment of the jury. He did this because he felt a duty to the society that had raised him, even though they rejected him, flawed as they were, and ignorant as they were, because he still regarded them as his people. To flee would have been to abandon or betray his people in some way, but to save himself from judgment by recanting his views would be to abandon his principles. The only moral option in his mind, was to accept the role his people had given him. That of a condemned man worthy of death. That way, he would die a member of that society with his principles intact, rather than as an exile or as a traitor to his truth. Because Socrates did this, he became something of a martyr for the very ideas they sought to suppress. Accepting his own death in that way proved his accusers wrong and made people doubt them, thereby amplifying the kind of changes he wished to bring about in Athenian society. In trying to suppress what he stood for, they turned him into the symbol future students of philosophy would rally around, and may even be a big part of why Greek society flourished intellectually, and is now regarded as the foundation of the Western intellectual tradition and culture.

The main reason I can't prove my speculations? Well, there is no surviving evidence that Jesus had ever heard of Socrates or knew anything of the Greek language, many sources seem to say he would only be familiar with Jewish traditions and ideas because of the society he lived in at the time. Also, there is the problem that almost every Christian alive today would be horrified at the notion that Jesus died not solely to absolve them of their sins and give them eternal life in heaven... but rather, died for his principles like Socrates, to show everyone willing to listen that truth is more precious than life because it is eternal, that death has no power anyway because reincarnation is real, and even to stop reincarnating isn't to cease existence, but to transcend this corrupted, imperfect world and become part of something greater, to see the truth (Gnosis) and break the cycle.

That is to say, at least in my opinion, even the whole idea of sin and punishment is the wrong perspective, though thinking of it that way is still better than living a purely hedonistic life. It works for some people, especially at a lower level of spiritual evolution, but it's really all about knowledge and ignorance. Sin is ultimately rooted in the false belief that this corrupted material world and our physical bodies are what matter, and have enduring importance. If you center truth and knowledge of that which is beyond this world, the eternal forms like geometric shapes, numbers, and yes, even astrology and the concept of God himself, and live your life accordingly... you'll naturally move away from sin, because it simply doesn't accomplish anything. What we call sin, or error, doesn't get you anywhere, it keeps you trapped in the material world and prevents spiritual and intellectual growth. Just like not studying for a test will result in you failing a test. The failing grade isn't a punishment for not studying, it's the natural result of not learning what you need to learn. Retaking a class isn't meant as a punishment either, but you can't move onto the next level until you meet the requirements.

You might find the answer that you seek in reading Jeffrey Furst's book, "Edgar Cayce's Story of Jesus", it was first published in 1978. I bought a copy that year, have replaced it a few times [I wore them out] He spoke of why Jesus went to that cross willingly, as he knew that was going to be his destiny when he prayed in the garden at Gethsemane, he was fully aware for 30 incarnations [that's the sum total of how many he had] that he had to atone for something he did... as He was the Adam that is written of in the Bible. He, and Eve too, got everyone kicked out of paradise, and to the ghetto. Earth is the "Devils Playground", it is said. And there have been many sins that have been committed by the innocent, that wouldn't have been committed had everyone been allowed to live in that "gated community", known as Eden. ...that's the way I can best describe what happened. He messed up. the sins He died for on that cross that the church says were your sins, are those that he was partially responsible for you having been so tempted, and committed. If you accept Yeshu'a as your "savior", your sat-guru,.. and guru's in India have been known to take on some of a disciples karma, so as to help that person... if you accept him as that... you cannot sign ever again. Otherwise you've blown it.
It is another one of the problems I find with Churchianity, this aggressive dogma of Hell fire and brimstone, better do it now or be lost for eternity, dogma... You cannot rip the skin from a snake, it must moult it on its own, to borrow an adage. It need not be in the present lifetime...it would be swell if you did and can handle it... but who do you know, or have heard of, that did, or could have, accepted the Nazarene under those conditions and did live a perfectly sin less life for the remainder of their years?

That is actually very close to what I was thinking about, that the typical perspective on Christ is a bit incorrect and missing a lot of context, but it seems like you're able to see the problems with it more from an Indian perspective, with the concepts of Karma and guru used to highlight certain parts of what's missing. But really if I'm right about all of this, there may well have been a lot of people like Christ or Socrates trying very hard to get people closer to the truth of human existence across cultures at various times.

Anyway, sorry for the derailment into discussing religious views, I guess it's just hard to talk about my relationship to Christ without... well, my issues with mainstream religious doctrines coming into it. LOL.

 

[athenian200]

So, I made a list of all the parts I could find that overlap with a part I have, for the April 2nd chart for Jesus... some of the parts are probably not too useful, and I mentioned some of these earlier, but I thought it would be wise to leave this post as a reference for myself so I could come back later and go over them all. I'm not yet sure what to make of the pattern, other than it seeming like it's shockingly easy to find overlapping parts between my chart and this one...

PHASE 200 (LIBRA 20°): A RABBI PERFORMING HIS DUTIES.

Jesus: Part of Communication (Ascendant + Mercury - Sun) & Part of Speculation [Behest] (Ascendant + Jupiter - Neptune)
athenian200: Part of Sudden Luck [Bequest] (Ascendant + Jupiter - Uranus)

PHASE 340 (PISCES 19°): A MASTER INSTRUCTING HIS DISCIPLE.

Jesus: Part of Fortune (Ascendant + Moon - Sun) & Part of Hope (Ascendant + Mercury - Jupiter)
athenian200: Part of Friends [Dramatization] (Ascendant + Moon - Uranus)

PHASE 1 (ARIES 1°): A WOMAN JUST RISEN FROM THE SEA. A SEAL IS EMBRACING HER.

Jesus: Part of Transformation of Other's Minds [Popularity] (Ascendant + Mercury - Pluto)
athenian200: Part of Commerce (Ascendant + Mars - Sun)

PHASE 339 (PISCES 9°): A JOCKEY SPURS HIS HORSE, INTENT ON OUT-DISTANCING HIS RIVALS.

Jesus: Part of Daughters [Comfort] (Ascendant + Venus - Moon)
athenian200: Part of Revelation [Insincerity] (Ascendant + Moon - Neptune)

PHASE 127 (LEO 7°): THE CONSTELLATIONS OF STARS SHINE BRILLIANTLY IN THE NIGHT SKY.

Jesus: Part of Treasure [Security] (Ascendant + Venus - Mercury)
athenian200: Part of Repression (Ascendant + Saturn - Pluto)

PHASE 79 (GEMINI 19°): A LARGE ARCHAIC VOLUME REVEALS A TRADITIONAL WISDOM.

Jesus: Part of Play [Variety] (Ascendant + Venus - Mars), Part of War (Ascendant + Mars - Pluto), Part of Ideal Love (Ascendant + Neptune - Venus)
athenian200: Part of Suicide II (Ascendant + Jupiter - House 12th)

PHASE 265 (SAGITTARIUS 25°): A CHUBBY BOY ON A HOBBY HORSE.

Jesus: Part of Praise [Sentiment] (Ascendant + Venus - Jupiter)
athenian200: Part of Spirit (Acendant + Sun - Moon)

PHASE 60 (TAURUS 30°): A PEACOCK PARADING ON THE TERRACE OF AN OLD CASTLE.

Jesus: Part of the Contentment of the Soul (Ascendant + Venus - Saturn)
athenian200: Part of Damage [Misunderstanding] (Ascendant + Neptune - Mars)

PHASE 150 (LEO 30°): AN UNSEALED LETTER.

Jesus: Part of Fascination [Perversion] (Ascendant + Venus - Uranus)
athenian200: Part of Gossip (Ascendant + Mercury - Neptune)

PHASE 337 (PISCES 7°): ILLUMINED BY A SHAFT OF LIGHT, A LARGE CROSS LIES ON ROCKS SURROUNDED BY SEA MIST.

Jesus: Part of Self-Sacrifice (Ascendant + Venus - Pluto), Part of Damage [Misunderstanding] (Ascendant + Neptune - Mars)
athenian200: Part of Tragedy/Fatality (Ascendant + Saturn - Sun) & Part of Debate [Daring Action, Arrogance] (Ascendant + Mars - Jupiter)

PHASE 81 (GEMINI 21°): A TUMULTUOUS LABOUR DEMONSTRATION.

Jesus: Part of Trickery (Ascendant + Mars - Moon)
athenian200: Part of Peril I (Ascendant + House 8th - Saturn)

PHASE 253 (SAGITTARIUS 13°): A WIDOW'S PAST BROUGHT TO LIGHT.

Jesus: Part of Obligations (Ascendant + Mars - Venus) & Part of Transformative Growth (Ascendant + Jupiter - Pluto)
athenian200: Part of Desire & Sexual Attraction (Ascendant + House 5th - Ruler 5th)

PHASE 7 (ARIES 7°): A MAN SUCCEEDS IN EXPRESSING HIMSELF SIMULTANEOUSLY IN TWO REALMS.

Jesus: Part of Debate [Daring Action, Arrogance] (Ascendant + Mars - Jupiter)
athenian200: Part of Death (medieval) (House 8th + Saturn - Moon)

PHASE 252 (SAGITTARIUS 12°): A FLAG TURNS INTO AN EAGLE; THE EAGLE INTO A CHANTICLEER SALUTING THE DAWN.

Jesus: Part of Surprise [?] (Ascendant + Mars - Uranus)
athenian200: Grandparents (Ascendant + Saturn - House 2nd)

PHASE 43 (TAURUS 13°): A PORTER CARRYING HEAVY BAGGAGE.

Jesus: Part of Benevolence (Ascendant + Jupiter - Mercury)
athenian200: Part of Imprisonment (Ascendant + Fortune - Neptune)

PHASE 355 (PISCES 25°): A RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATION SUCCEEDS IN OVERCOMING THE CORRUPTING INFLUENCE OF PERVERTED PRACTICES AND MATERIALIZED IDEALS.

Jesus: Part of Discord (Ascendant + Jupiter - Mars)
athenian200: Natal Mercury position, Part of Merchandise I (Ascendant + Moon - Spirit)

PHASE 100 (CANCER 10°): A LARGE DIAMOND IN THE FIRST STAGES OF THE CUTTING PROCESS.

Jesus: Part of Hidden Identity [Influence, Oration] (Ascendant + Saturn - Moon)
athenian200: Part of Distress [Sickness] (Ascendant + Mars - Saturn)

PHASE 201 (LIBRA 21°): A SUNDAY CROWD ENJOYING THE BEACH.

Jesus: Part of Surgery [Army, Police] (Ascendant + Saturn - Mars)
athenian200: Part of Noble & Illustrious Acquaintances (Ascendant + Sun - Fortune)

PHASE 45 (TAURUS 15°): HEAD COVERED WITH A RAKISH SILK HAT, MUFFLED AGAINST THE COLD, A MAN BRAVES A STORM.

Jesus: Part of Slander [Timidity] (Ascendant + Saturn - Neptune)
athenian200: Part of Bankruptcy (Jupiter + Neptune - Uranus)

PHASE 99 (CANCER 9°): A SMALL, NAKED GIRL BENDS OVER A POND TRYING TO CATCH A FISH.

Jesus: Part of Repression (Ascendant + Saturn - Pluto)
athenian200: Part of Praise [Sentiment] (Ascendant + Venus - Jupiter), Part of Increase and Benefits (Ascendant + Jupiter - Sun)

PHASE 10 (ARIES 10°): A TEACHER GIVES NEW SYMBOLIC FORMS TO TRADITIONAL IMAGES.

Jesus: Part of Unusual Events [Misinterpretation] (Ascendant + Uranus - Moon)
athenian200: Part of Short Journeys (Ascendant + House 3rd - Ruler 3rd)

PHASE 158 (VIRGO 8°): A FIVE-YEAR-OLD CHILD TAKES A FIRST DANCING LESSON.

Jesus: Part of Omens & Signs (Ascendant + Uranus - Mercury)
athenian200: Part of Danger [Violence] (Ascendant + Mercury - Saturn)

PHASE 213 (SCORPIO 3°): A HOUSE-RAISING PARTY IN A SMALL VILLAGE ENLISTS THE NEIGHBORS' COOPERATION.

Jesus: Part of Wastefulness (Ascendant + Uranus - Venus)
athenian200: Part of Gender (Midheaven + Ascendant - Moon)

PHASE 296 (CAPRICORN 26°): A NATURE SPIRIT DANCING IN THE IRIDESCENT MIST OF A WATERFALL.

Jesus: Part of Happiness [Entertainment] (Ascendant + Uranus - Jupiter)
athenian200: Part of Resigning (Saturn + Jupiter - Sun)

PHASE 315 (AQUARIUS 15°): TWO LOVEBIRDS SITTING ON A FENCE AND SINGING HAPPILY.

Jesus: Part of Termination [Occultism] (Ascendant + Uranus - Neptune)
athenian200: Part of Obligations (Ascendant + Mars - Venus)

PHASE 350 (PISCES 20°): A TABLE SET FOR AN EVENING MEAL.

Jesus: Part of Organization [Miracles, Gavel{?}] (Ascendant + Pluto - Sun)
athenian200: Part of Wealth (Ascendant + House 2nd - Ruler 2nd)

PHASE 354 (PISCES 24°): ON A SMALL ISLAND SURROUNDED BY THE VAST EXPANSE OF THE SEA, PEOPLE ARE SEEN LIVING IN CLOSE INTERACTION.

Jesus: Part of Radical Change (Ascendant + Pluto - Uranus)
athenian200: True Node, Part of Faithfulness [Stability] (Ascendant + Saturn - Mercury)

PHASE 262 (SAGITTARIUS 22°): A CHINESE LAUNDRY.

Jesus: Part of Inheritance & Legacy (Ascendant + Moon - Saturn)
athenian200: Pars Hyleg (Ascendant + Moon - Syzygy)

PHASE 115 (CANCER 25°): A WILL-FULL MAN IS OVERSHADOWED BY A DESCENT OF SUPERIOR POWER.

Jesus: Part of Bankruptcy (Jupiter - Neptune + Uranus)
athenian200: Part of Influence & Magnetism (Ascendant + Pluto - Moon)

 

[piercethevale]

So, I made a list of all the parts I could find that overlap with a part I have, for the April 2nd chart for Jesus... some of the parts are probably not too useful, and I mentioned some of these earlier, but I thought it would be wise to leave this post as a reference for myself so I could come back later and go over them all. I'm not yet sure what to make of the pattern, other than it seeming like it's shockingly easy to find overlapping parts between my chart and this one...

PHASE 200 (LIBRA 20°): A RABBI PERFORMING HIS DUTIES.

Jesus: Part of Communication (Ascendant + Mercury - Sun) & Part of Speculation [Behest] (Ascendant + Jupiter - Neptune)
athenian200: Part of Sudden Luck [Bequest] (Ascendant + Jupiter - Uranus)

Okay then, a Part of Identity title given for the same formula is one I never came across in all the research I did, and had never heard of it until now.
That's another why I am frustrated so much by new formatting system here. I can't edit, add to, or remove anything from that first post in the Astrology Parts thread I initiated way back in 2011. That was a labor of dedication and service, and something I found, or certainly believed, was very sorely needed on the internet at the time. A comprehensive list of every title, and type of formulated Part/Lot known, and unknown, in one place, one website, that people could rely on, than rather to go searching all over, and not even knowing where to search, to begin with. I thought that I would be able to keep it up to date and even have the forum mgt. find someone that could continue on with the upkeep, a type of "curator", I guess might be proper name for such a person, when I would no longer be able, or around, anymore.

But, someone could just copy everything I have posted, break it down into multiple, manageable sized, posts and start a new thread someday, and also be able to edit, rectify, and even add additional titles, footnotes, and the like.
I do have some observations, and comments, as to some of all else that you wrote above.

That 7th degree of Leo, has been most noticeably significant to me as for, one reason it is the location of the North Node in the USA's natal chart, and that the symbolism is significant as to this nation being born from a number of colonies founded by the persecuted, the unwelcome, brethren of various protestant faiths, that the year of its founding was 1776 and that number is twice that of 888, the Gnostic sourced number for the Christ. Author, and the one that my published introduced me to, that turned out, surprisingly, to also have been an old acquaintance of my yogi friend, Suryakant, [the late Steve Johnson], and Dorothy sent me a copy of one of her published books on the subject of Saint Germain and the founding of the nation, and it is a book loaded with occult source material, it's got quite a bibliography... even Socrates, Plato, Francis Bacon, you name anyone that pops to mind and it's likely that she made a ref. to them somewhere in that book. She believes that 'Higher Forces' were behind the exploration, and settlement of the "New World", and goes into great depth as to impress upon the reader that she has done some impressive research. I know that I already mentioned that Dorothy claimed to be the only, presently alive, disciple of Saint Germain, that is if she is still among the living?
The 7th deg. of Leo is the location of Suryakant's natal N.Node, my natal S. Node, Phoenix Venus' natal M.C. Whenever someone I knew, or had met, who made some contribution to "the effort" that had the 7th degree of Leo prominent in their natal chart, somewhere, Upon learning of it, always took that to be a "sign" of validation of that person's sincerity, that I needed to check out that persons' natal astrology very thoroughly.

Libra 20* is the location of the USA's natal Part of Bankruptcy, and the moment I learned of it, I immediately thought of family bankers, financiers, known as the Rothchilds, if you follow my drift?
Some of what you about Socrates and Plato I do recall having read and, or, heard about but that was more than fifty years ago, so those are very dim memories, and I lost interest in the more mundane philosophers, and philosophies, particularly the ancient ones, many, many, years ago. I did read all of Carlos Castenada's books, that I knew of up about 1980, my brother got very interested in those writings. When there is an absence of God in such works, by mention, or reference, and in the gist of that authors beliefs, I lose interest. I find no use for it, as for myself, anyways. I know that such works are held in high esteem by others for many different reasons, philosophical, cultural, historical, etc. But having never had a voracious appetite for reading itself, in general, which I mentioned in a number of posts and threads I've written, I just had better things to do with my time. I'm not saying they are waste of time, just time I felt was better spent as to "my time". I was always the type that is physically oriented in daily activities, occupation, played a number of sports. My mom once made the observation of me as someone that preferred the trades, even menial labor, as opposed to cerebral oriented occupations, as like to keep my mind free so "as to muse about the 'Heavies' ", as one college, freshman year, roommate of mine labeled them as.
Too many in your list for me to, make note to, and comment on and a few of those degrees I have already commented on in some thread, or post, in this forum, or book, or some other forum, over the years. If you think that you have some serious need of input from me for what ever reason you believe you have, I'll do what I can. I've just got a little too much "on my plate" at present This ongoing effort, now in the 12th month, of trying to find more permanent living quarters, renting a succession of rooms in one old and cheap hotel after another, is taking it's toll on me. ...and I've gotten much more conservative with my time now, than I was ever before. I've a cousin 9 years my junior, that lost his daughter of 35 this past month, and one of my new friends I met at one of the hotels I lived in a couple of months, she is ten years younger [born Feb. 27, 1963, a day of an awesome Venus Jupiter conjunction, she is the archetype of the benevolent motherly type, and has the life stories to go with it. What I would say to be "the last person that seems to deserve such tragedy"] and and had to suddenly leave for her home State of Hawaii, on Friday, as her daughter of 34 is in a coma, just as my cousin's daughter was, and is the only surviving parent, her husband died about 7 years ago in his early to mid 50's, everyday I think more about how it's presently one day less that I have been given to live myself, and it is now an awareness of mine that there are many things I wanted to do before my time is up, that are not going to be done before I do. It's great to find that more of you younger folks are getting interested in this stuff. I was beginning to fret a bit about who's going to "pick up the ball" and carry it to the goal, so to speak.

[over the word limit again... continued next post. ptv]

 

[piercethevale]

Ideally, it would be someone that is affected by all the Planets, and is assured about Pluto's status is of no greater concern to anyone other than an astrologer. The astronomers can say whatever the He** they want to, it won't change my mind in the least. As it sounds that you think that all the Planets are affecting you, and have a possibility of having some of that DNA from that particular bloodline, too... wonderful... maybe you have "arrived", uknowaddImean? Need a clairvoyant, or think that you could use a bit of that kind of help? I do so recommend, Ukno-who. She has a website of her own, and does offer down right dirt cheap, first time consultations, from time to time, in fact every year that I've known her. Like I wrote, she has proven herself nearly infallible about matters of the past and the present. She's got the gift and bloodlines seem to be one of her "specialties". She seemingly does it almost effortlessly. Dane even said that there is only so much that he could figure out and that it would take someone in the future, that has a complex natal chart that has every kind of Astrological aspect in it, or nearly so, to figure this stuff out completely,
Someone with that natal chart and that bloodline would be perfect, IMHO, of course.
But, it's going to be more of a thankless, volunteer, gotta love the abuse, confidante in themself, person with a bit of steel to their mettle. So many nay sayers at present, and may likely get even more to their ranks with each passing year. Like the Fortune in a cookie I got once, and Suryakant was present, when I had got some Chinese takeout, from Hop Sings restaurant, in the old historic section of Folsom. There were four cookies in a zip lock baggy, as that is the way they put them in your bag of food, I.e two per customer. I was telling Suryakant that I had seen so many "signs" and omens, in that year, and the three or four previous, that I was convinced that God was behind it, one way or another, and I said that I was so certain that if I had missed seeing one that was important, that [in my words] "God would write on a piece of paper, wrap that paper around a brick, and throw it throw it through my window and so that it would land at my feet." Then I added, in I am so confident is saying so, that I'll ask God for an answer right now, from the Fortune in this cookie, [and I opened the bag in front of Suryakant, and picked one pout randomly] to something that I've been trying to figure out, which is, how can I be expected, and why me, to write a book that is going to be so important, as Clarisse has indicated, when I have natal Mercury in the 28th of Aries [you can look up the entire text that Dane wrote for that. [...and I reminded Suryakant what the Sabian Symbol was... [ibid] "ARIES 28°: A LARGE AUDIENCE CONFRONTS THE PERFORMER WHO DISAPPOINTED ITS EXPECTATIONS.", as we're talking about Mercury, here, the Planet that rules communication, that bestows the abilities that are needed] That Fortune read as [and I have a photo of it, in the hard drive of that computer that I need to get repaired... but there's a thread or two in the forum in which I posted the image] that "fortune" read as "You create your own stage and the audience is waiting". Suryakant about spit up his chop suey and rice.
If you think that you got the "calling", "step up to the plate and take some swings at it." for one old adage, "run it up the flag pole and see if anyone salutes it?", as for another... by all means, please do, or at least try if you think that you've got the understanding and the ability, and especially the Teflon ego, that I think you'll find needed for the work... that audience IS waiting, that play" has a run of nearly 20 years, so to speak, and there's always someone in that audience, and you never know when there'll be a "packed house".... I think that day is going to come some years ahead yet. Young talent is needed...!

I do have one other observation that I think you possibly could need to hear and that is try to discern those Parts from odd , from singularly unique, constructs of equations as being more largely suspect of being of no use and, or, concern to natal charts. Such as the Part of Short Journeys. I'm rather convinced that is for horary use, The Part of Bankruptcy is from an equation that makes no consideration to the Asc. and the Asc. is the "personal point". However, I am willing to wager that it 100% legit, concerning the mundane. Just two examples of what I am talking about.

 

[athenian200]

Okay then, a Part of Identity title given for the same formula is one I never came across in all the research I did, and had never heard of it until now.
That's another why I am frustrated so much by new formatting system here. I can't edit, add to, or remove anything from that first post in the Astrology Parts thread I initiated way back in 2011.

Yeah, I've definitely run into similar problems. I feel like I struggle to stay under the character limit with some of my posts, and I can imagine it's even worse if you were trying to use the forums as a sort of "Wiki" for something you were researching...

That 7th degree of Leo, has been most noticeably significant to me as for, one reason it is the location of the North Node in the USA's natal chart, and that the symbolism is significant as to this nation being born from a number of colonies founded by the persecuted, the unwelcome, brethren of various protestant faiths, that the year of its founding was 1776 and that number is twice that of 888, the Gnostic sourced number for the Christ.

888? That's so weird... my birth year is 1988. But yeah, I was kind of wondering if any of those degrees would jump out at you as significant. Mainly I was just posting the list so that I wouldn't have to keep double-checking. I feel like recently I've been learning a lot of odd things about the day I was born I never would have thought about before. Like the fact that the last full moon and the last new moon before my birth were both eclipses... and that I was one day short of sharing a birthday with Jesus? Granted, that alone isn't unique enough to stop the presses over, but it stands out somehow.

The 7th deg. of Leo is the location of Suryakant's natal N.Node, my natal S. Node, Phoenix Venus' natal M.C. Whenever someone I knew, or had met, who made some contribution to "the effort" that had the 7th degree of Leo prominent in their natal chart, somewhere, Upon learning of it, always took that to be a "sign" of validation of that person's sincerity, that I needed to check out that persons' natal astrology very thoroughly.

Yeah, it's not prominent in my chart, but it is my Part of Repression, which seems odd because I am actually interested in astrology. Having that as a Part of Repression seemingly suggests I wouldn't be interested in astrology at all. Either that, or Ascendant + Saturn - Pluto only sometimes means repression, and could also refer to struggles that involve changes or transformation depending on the individual and how they react to Saturn energy. The formula is probably more important than the name in the end.

I've just got a little too much "on my plate" at present This ongoing effort, now in the 12th month, of trying to find more permanent living quarters, renting a succession of rooms in one old and cheap hotel after another, is taking it's toll on me. ...and I've gotten much more conservative with my time now, than I was ever before. I've a cousin 9 years my junior, that lost his daughter of 35 this past month, and one of my new friends I met at one of the hotels I lived in a couple of months, she is ten years younger [born Feb. 27, 1963, a day of an awesome Venus Jupiter conjunction, she is the archetype of the benevolent motherly type, and has the life stories to go with it. What I would say to be "the last person that seems to deserve such tragedy"] and and had to suddenly leave for her home State of Hawaii, on Friday, as her daughter of 34 is in a coma, just as my cousin's daughter was, and is the only surviving parent, her husband died about 7 years ago in his early to mid 50's, everyday I think more about how it's presently one day less that I have been given to live myself, and it is now an awareness of mine that there are many things I wanted to do before my time is up, that are not going to be done before I do.

Oh, certainly, having a place to live is the most important thing. Rest assured, there's nothing I'm doing here that's urgent enough that I'd want you to take time away from finding a place to live. I just wish I could do more to help you out with living quarters, honestly. This kind of thing is why I regret not finding gainful employment sometimes. Could have probably helped a lot of my online friends stay out of homeless shelters, if I had more resources. I've had more than one online friend over the years who I lost touch with as a result of very similar circumstances. I just hope you'll be all right.

Need a clairvoyant, or think that you could use a bit of that kind of help? I do so recommend, Ukno-who. She has a website of her own, and does offer down right dirt cheap, first time consultations, from time to time, in fact every year that I've known her. Like I wrote, she has proven herself nearly infallible about matters of the past and the present. She's got the gift and bloodlines seem to be one of her "specialties". She seemingly does it almost effortlessly.

Well, I am admittedly curious what she would say. Though, I get the impression she's fairly famous and someone of her caliber would likely be bored if she looked at my past... LOL. I also noticed that unfortunately her website seems to be down? I was interested enough to check her website after you mentioned her name, but noted it was down and just assumed she isn't taking new clients. If we're talking about the same person, she started doing her readings in 1977, which is actually the birth year of one of the three characters I always used to dream about.

Dane even said that there is only so much that he could figure out and that it would take someone in the future, that has a complex natal chart that has every kind of Astrological aspect in it, or nearly so, to figure this stuff out completely,
Someone with that natal chart and that bloodline would be perfect, IMHO, of course.
But, it's going to be more of a thankless, volunteer, gotta love the abuse, confidante in themself, person with a bit of steel to their mettle. So many nay sayers at present, and may likely get even more to their ranks with each passing year.

I am pretty used to things being thankless, volunteer-oriented and involving a lot of abuse... I once did a lot of work on an obscure open-source project where I had a "boss" that yelled at me like I was an employee for a major software company while I was volunteering. Self-confidence is admittedly not my strong suit, though. Mostly because I'm always open to the possibility I missed something, which makes me doubt myself enough to entertain the conclusions of critics quite often.

"ARIES 28°: A LARGE AUDIENCE CONFRONTS THE PERFORMER WHO DISAPPOINTED ITS EXPECTATIONS.", as we're talking about Mercury, here, the Planet that rules communication, that bestows the abilities that are needed] That Fortune read as [and I have a photo of it, in the hard drive of that computer that I need to get repaired... but there's a thread or two in the forum in which I posted the image] that "fortune" read as "You create your own stage and the audience is waiting". Suryakant about spit up his chop suey and rice.

Wow, that's quite an inspiring message you got.

I do have one other observation that I think you possibly could need to hear and that is try to discern those Parts from odd , from singularly unique, constructs of equations as being more largely suspect of being of no use and, or, concern to natal charts. Such as the Part of Short Journeys. I'm rather convinced that is for horary use, The Part of Bankruptcy is from an equation that makes no consideration to the Asc. and the Asc. is the "personal point". However, I am willing to wager that it 100% legit, concerning the mundane. Just two examples of what I am talking about.

That was actually the other thing I was curious about... I wasn't sure which parts are worth looking at, and was wondering how you decide which ones are worth paying attention to. So the main one is that it needs to involve the Ascendant, and the other is that it should ideally seem to be relevant to actual planets and meaningful points on the chart rather than being purely mathematical.

 

[piercethevale]

Yeah, I've definitely run into similar problems. I feel like I struggle to stay under the character limit with some of my posts, and I can imagine it's even worse if you were trying to use the forums as a sort of "Wiki" for something you were researching...


888? That's so weird... my birth year is 1988. But yeah, I was kind of wondering if any of those degrees would jump out at you as significant. Mainly I was just posting the list so that I wouldn't have to keep double-checking. I feel like recently I've been learning a lot of odd things about the day I was born I never would have thought about before. Like the fact that the last full moon and the last new moon before my birth were both eclipses... and that I was one day short of sharing a birthday with Jesus? Granted, that alone isn't unique enough to stop the presses over, but it stands out somehow.

Yeah, it's not prominent in my chart, but it is my Part of Repression, which seems odd because I am actually interested in astrology. Having that as a Part of Repression seemingly suggests I wouldn't be interested in astrology at all. Either that, or Ascendant + Saturn - Pluto only sometimes means repression, and could also refer to struggles that involve changes or transformation depending on the individual and how they react to Saturn energy. The formula is probably more important than the name in the end.

Oh, certainly, having a place to live is the most important thing. Rest assured, there's nothing I'm doing here that's urgent enough that I'd want you to take time away from finding a place to live. I just wish I could do more to help you out with living quarters, honestly. This kind of thing is why I regret not finding gainful employment sometimes. Could have probably helped a lot of my online friends stay out of homeless shelters, if I had more resources. I've had more than one online friend over the years who I lost touch with as a result of very similar circumstances. I just hope you'll be all right.

Well, I am admittedly curious what she would say. Though, I get the impression she's fairly famous and someone of her caliber would likely be bored if she looked at my past... LOL. I also noticed that unfortunately her website seems to be down? I was interested enough to check her website after you mentioned her name, but noted it was down and just assumed she isn't taking new clients. If we're talking about the same person, she started doing her readings in 1977, which is actually the birth year of one of the three characters I always used to dream about.

I am pretty used to things being thankless, volunteer-oriented and involving a lot of abuse... I once did a lot of work on an obscure open-source project where I had a "boss" that yelled at me like I was an employee for a major software company while I was volunteering. Self-confidence is admittedly not my strong suit, though. Mostly because I'm always open to the possibility I missed something, which makes me doubt myself enough to entertain the conclusions of critics quite often.

Wow, that's quite an inspiring message you got.

That was actually the other thing I was curious about... I wasn't sure which parts are worth looking at, and was wondering how you decide which ones are worth paying attention to. So the main one is that it needs to involve the Ascendant, and the other is that it should ideally seem to be relevant to actual planets and meaningful points on the chart rather than being purely mathematical.

Actually you did share the same day of the year, that is until the year 2000, [as for every new century that is divisible by four, we are to add a day to all dates prior to when Pope Gregory had everyone switch from the Julian calendar, as of the year 2000, or it may supposed to be the year after, as the new century actually began on the 1st of January, 2001 {remember that there is no year 0 A.D.}] Now, in this present century, your aunt shares the same day of the year, as to her birth day.
In the year 2400 [or maybe it's supposed to be 2401?] That day will then become April 3rd. It was on March 19th, by the old Julian calendar. ...and the Hebrews didn't use any calendars but their own... although they were under Roman rule when the "Naz" was born, but different years were used by different sects, some shared the same, some were a bit different, some were greatly different, as to the number of the year.

Somewhere in the Tanakh, the Old Testament, there is a passage that says that the Hebrews can observe the counting of time, even as to when a day ends and the next begins in any manner they wish to. .. but God, allegedly, isn't allowing the "gentiles" that same "courtesy".
But I have found some pretty profound significance in Gregorian calendar birth dates, at least regarding a few that I met between 1999 and 2003.
One born April 3rd, 1957 at 3:03 p.m., another on June 6th, 1962 at 6:06 a.m, and then there's Kenny, aka Kenfolk, born November 11, 1969 at 11:22 a.m. ["In the eleventh month, on the eleventh day, at the eleventh hour"... and 22 minutes]

Never heard of the "Naz", or the use of that "nickname", before?
Well then, can you dig infinity?
check it out...

 

[piercethevale]

Yeah, Uno-who, has had health issues for a bit of a while now. she is a little more than four years older than I am.
I'm hoping that she recovers, but when one "gets up there" in age... ya' know?
...and she wouldn't find you boring at all, she knows that she was given her "gift" as to help those that need to know about things that can't be found out from any other source. As you were born in 1988 at 8:04, that's three 8's, and you were born on an April 1st, to boot...! Ya never know, or maybe you will if you do eventually can get a reading from Her, or find another that is as gifted and sincere. You might discover for yourself, by keeping at this analysis of your natal chart and learning what you can from the Yeshu'a chart, from what I've written and, also, from what you may learn by yourself. I'm certain that there's much more to learn from that chart, than I have amassed presently, and likely more than I ever will altogether.
I did mention doing a composite chart with that of "The Naz", but if you should chose to, remember that astrodienst has "fudged" the data since I first produced that chart. So when using astrodienst to generate such a chart, you have to figure what the difference is between what they presently claim is the location of any point, be it planet, luminary, house cusp, etc. that is used in a formulae for a Part/Lot, then add or subtract half the difference from the composite chart that is generated. Trust me on that one... if anything was in error, it was a very slight error, and hardly enough to move any Part out of, or into, the previous or the following degree... although if something comes out to be a few seconds to one side or the other, it is worth a bit of consideration as to a little bit of rectification may have been needed, but certainly no where as to near how much astrodienst moved Pluto, which was almost two minutes of a degree. The JPL scientist that wrote that program, which was for use by NASA, gave Pluto the largest amount of "fudge factor" noting that an allowance of up to, but no more than, plus, or minus, two minutes of a degree, was a possibility. The last time I checked they had added one minute and fifty nine seconds of a degree.

As astrodienst has been moving stuff around a number of times, and even before they said the date was when they changed to a different program, I can't help you figure that by giving you giving you the amounts I had to do the same with some years ago, and if I were to go to the trouble as to what is needed to do today, they just might be monitoring my posts and change all of it again tonight [and some of the swiftest didn't move at all, from where they were on my original chart, where-as Pluto is the slowest of them all, and being so far out in space, two minutes of a degree amounts to well over twenty million miles added, or actually subtracted as Pluto was retrograde at the time, but however you wish to call it, they did add to the originally given location]. I do have a very legible image of the true natal chart posted in the thread that I initiated,

I think that one should check the Hermetic Lots, the Part of Inheritance & Legacy, the Part of Love & Appreciation, the Part of Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances, the reverse formula for that, the reverse Hermetic Lot of Eros, Part of Fortune, of Soul, Part of Bondage, definitely the Part of Service [as both Parts share the same degree in the natal chart of Yeshu'a, the 30th of Aquarius, the one degree symbolism that Dane changed to the longest worded Sabian Symbol, and seemingly so radically to the "uninitiated"... yet remains the same in meaning, symbolically. I find it to possibly be the closest one might come to describing the Great White Lodge, aka, the Great White Brotherhood, aka, the Ascended Masters, and it is the closest as far as all the Sabian Symbols might be so considered... which adds immense credibility that in one reading Edgar Cayce gave, and remember what was said about him always channeling one of those "Masters", when the question was about anything other than physical health matters, when the one that spoke through him was Yeshu'a himself.
..

Kind of ironic, my having to mention it, at this particular time in the USA.
As He said something about people awaiting a 'second coming", and he said that he's already been back, a couple of times. Not by birth, but by manifesting a physical body, which is allegedly the ability of a number, if not all, of the "ascended" ones... as it kind of reminds me of what an elected member of the gov't said about "having been to the border", in a reverse kind of way [When are you coming back? I've already been back, and more than once.] ...the difference between the two, is one of them wasn't lying]

I'll post any more Parts I think to be of special interest... later on...football is on the tube tonight, and I forgot and it's now in the 4th quarter... boo hoo, waaaaaa

 

[athenian200]

Actually you did share the same day of the year, that is until the year 2000, [as for every new century that is divisible by four, we are to add a day to all dates prior to when Pope Gregory had everyone switch from the Julian calendar, as of the year 2000, or it may supposed to be the year after, as the new century actually began on the 1st of January, 2001 {remember that there is no year 0 A.D.}] Now, in this present century, your aunt shares the same day of the year, as to her birth day.
In the year 2400 [or maybe it's supposed to be 2401?] That day will then become April 3rd. It was on March 19th, by the old Julian calendar.

Oh, yeah, I just checked converting my birth date to the Julian calendar. It says March 19th. So, I would have been a Pisces if we were still using the Julian Calendar, that's so weird, right?

Never heard of the "Naz", or the use of that "nickname", before?

I just assumed it was short for "The Nazerene," which is something I've heard Jesus called before.

Yeah, Uno-who, has had health issues for a bit of a while now. she is a little more than four years older than I am.
I'm hoping that she recovers, but when one "gets up there" in age... ya' know?

Yeah, I was afraid of that, that she might have been forced into retirement by her age and health problems, and maybe she doesn't have a lot of energy left to do readings for people.

...and she wouldn't find you boring at all, she knows that she was given her "gift" as to help those that need to know about things that can't be found out from any other source. As you were born in 1988 at 8:04, that's three 8's, and you were born on an April 1st, to boot...!

Thanks, I appreciate that. I suppose it wouldn't hurt anything for me to reach out and ask what her rates are. It's possible that since she's been dealing with declining health off and on, she just forgot to renew her domain/hosting, or had to cancel it to save money, and all her existing clients just use her phone number like they have for years.

I did mention doing a composite chart with that of "The Naz", but if you should chose to, remember that astrodienst has "fudged" the data since I first produced that chart. So when using astrodienst to generate such a chart, you have to figure what the difference is between what they presently claim is the location of any point, be it planet, luminary, house cusp, etc. that is used in a formulae for a Part/Lot, then add or subtract half the difference from the composite chart that is generated.

That's actually one of the reasons I haven't done a composite yet. I don't trust Astrodienst's data for that year at all, it randomly seems to shift between calling that date April 4th and April 2nd depending on when I check, and I'm looking for an old program I have that can cast these charts. I have it on an old hard drive and it does everything completely offline. Let's just say I am the type of person who, despite being tech-savvy, has a bit of distrust towards online services that can change their backend data at will. I deal with that problem in a different arena already, outside of astrology, and that's one of the reasons I downloaded that program.

I think that one should check the Hermetic Lots, the Part of Inheritance & Legacy, the Part of Love & Appreciation, the Part of Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances, the reverse formula for that, the reverse Hermetic Lot of Eros, Part of Fortune, of Soul, Part of Bondage, definitely the Part of Service [as both Parts share the same degree in the natal chart of Yeshu'a, the 30th of Aquarius, the one degree symbolism that Dane changed to the longest worded Sabian Symbol, and seemingly so radically to the "uninitiated"... yet remains the same in meaning, symbolically.

I definitely will check on those, now that you've mentioned them.

So, while you were away, I was looking at Sabian Symbols for other parts in my chart, and for whatever reason I stumbled upon the Part of Exile (Ascendant + Uranus - Saturn) and the Part of Sudden Parting (Ascendant - Saturn + Uranus)...

My Part of Exile is Gemini 15, and my Part of Sudden Parting is Gemini 18. For reference, my Ascendant is Gemini 16, so it's not quite conjunct Exile but it's right in the middle of them, closer to Exile.

Part of Exile:

PHASE 75 (GEMINI 15°): TWO DUTCH CHILDREN TALKING TO EACH OTHER, EXCHANGING THEIR KNOWLEDGE.

KEYNOTE: The need to clarify one's experiences through actual contacts with like-minded individuals.

Part of Sudden Parting:

PHASE 78 (GEMINI 18°): TWO CHINESE MEN CONVERSE IN THEIR NATIVE TONGUE IN AN AMERICAN CITY.

KEYNOTE: The need for the mind to retain its independence from its physical environment in order to concentrate on its special problems.

So, what stands out to me about these parts? Well, while my Part of Exile isn't conjunct my Ascendant in Gemini 16, it's only one degree before it. The Gemini 18 symbol has shockingly close symbolism to the Gemini 15 one, too. But more importantly, these two parts both make me think of the symbolism for Sagittarius 22 where the Pars Hyleg is located, the one about a Chinese Laundry. Not sure if the Part of Exile being almost being a degree away from my Ascendant counts for anything, since it isn't conjunct, but it definitely feels like it would make sense if it did...

The thing is, if Exile implies separation from society and the Ascendant represents the body or identity, that isn't too far off from the truth.

I guess it goes back to the three characters I mentioned earlier. The only thing all three of them have in common is that all of them are dissatisfied with my life/body for different reasons. Althea doesn't want to live in my body because she is a woman. Solok finds my body annoying because it's human and thus runs out of energy quickly and can't maintain the level of Vulcan discipline and detachment he needs when pushing for my behavior to be more logical. James is the most comfortable with the body itself, but feels deeply alienated from the culture here in a lot of ways.

It could even be significant that it's the degree before my Ascendant, rather than my Ascendant. The Exile feeling hits the degree right before my identity, preventing it from integrating fully in the first place. It's right on the last degree of the 12th house, before the first one starts. So I'm stuck in this state of incoherency, like a milder version of what happened in Assassin's Creed when Clay experienced the "Bleeding Effect. He used the "Animus" machine too much and found that all his past life memories were blending into each other and he couldn't tell who he was or what century it was anymore. Only it's not quite making me insane so much as just overwhelmed and indecisive, because unlike in the game, the fragmented pieces are aware of each other and try to work together like an ineffective bureaucracy to run my life as well as they can, but they're not good at working together and are thus limited in what they can accomplish.

It would take too long to explain the game's story here, but basically, it involves a lot of stuff about an ancient organization called the Templars trying to control the world from behind the scenes and another ancient organization called the Assassins trying to stop them, and they have a machine that allows people to experience the memories of their ancestors and gain their skills and memories called the Animus. Basically, the whole plot revolves around stuff like ancient bloodlines, past lives, shadowy organizations, and the idea of the Biblical stories having a hidden meaning other than what we've been told.

 

[athenian200]

So, I checked out some of the other parts. I already know Jesus has his Part of Inheritance & Legacy conjunct my Part of Spirit, but I never checked out the symbol for mine because it doesn't overlap with anything in his chart or anything in mine. My Part of Inheritance & Legacy (Ascendant + Moon - Saturn) is:

PHASE 347 (PISCES 17°): AN EASTER PARADE.

KEYNOTE: The capacity inherent in all great sociocultural Images to unite the members of a community in a display of excellence.

Pisces 18, the next symbol over, is symbolically active in the USA chart, with a Part of Catastrophe and a Part of Intelligence/Skill. Pisces 19 is actually my Part of Friends and overlaps with the Part of Fortune given for Jesus. Pisces 17 is really just my own personal thing, it seems.

Well, I mean... the most obvious surface-level interpretation of this symbol is that my ancestors were people who went to church on Sunday? My Grandma's generation did, and probably the ones before that did too. But it got harder and harder to find a church we resonated with, until... we found ourselves living like some kind of American Christian version of the Essenes, keeping ourselves apart and cynically judging the way religious faith is expressed in our culture as somehow inadequate and maybe even corrupting.

I did actually just check, and my Grandma's chart has Pisces 17 as her Part of Fortune. So apparently I was right guessing that it had something to do with her generation. She was part of the Silent Generation, and she played a big role in raising me too, almost more than my actual parents. Especially since I wasn't going to school, I was at home with her a lot as a child, listening to her read stories about virtue. I even got interested in poetry by reading her Ideals magazines, and learned about astrology initially by reading her old Farmer's Almanac for the year I was born. I learned what a moon sign was for the first time and that mine was in Libra at a very young age, which stuck with me because I related to it more than my sun sign.

My Part of Love & Appreciation (Ascendant + Venus - Sun) is:

PHASE 122 (LEO 2°): AN EPIDEMIC OF THE MUMPS.

KEYNOTE: The spreading power of individual crises through a collectivity.

Now, that one is tough... I can't think of how this applies to my life? But I do know that in the chart of Jesus, his Part of Love & Appreciation is Leo 26, which is the same degree as my natal Lilith. And in the USA chart, it's Aries 12. So if Jesus loves and appreciates divine promise, and the US loves and appreciates the idea of natural law... then that must mean I love and appreciate... a good crisis and the opportunity it presents?

Well, I'm not going to lie, there have been a few times in my life when I tried to benefit from a crisis... like, one time I had just purchased a GPU right before there was a shortage. Then people were paying inflated prices on eBay for the graphics cards. I didn't really need mine that badly, and sold it for twice what I paid. Then I waited for the shortage to end, and bought a better card than the one I sold. I wasn't happy that the other people were suffering, but I was happy that I benefited from the situation, I guess? I don't know, I just can't think of a way that having this as my part of Love and Appreciation doesn't make me seem like a terrible person. LOL.

 

[piercethevale]

Oh, yeah, I just checked converting my birth date to the Julian calendar. It says March 19th. So, I would have been a Pisces if we were still using the Julian Calendar, that's so weird, right?


I just assumed it was short for "The Nazerene," which is something I've heard Jesus called before.


Yeah, I was afraid of that, that she might have been forced into retirement by her age and health problems, and maybe she doesn't have a lot of energy left to do readings for people.

Thanks, I appreciate that. I suppose it wouldn't hurt anything for me to reach out and ask what her rates are. It's possible that since she's been dealing with declining health off and on, she just forgot to renew her domain/hosting, or had to cancel it to save money, and all her existing clients just use her phone number like they have for years.

That's actually one of the reasons I haven't done a composite yet. I don't trust Astrodienst's data for that year at all, it randomly seems to shift between calling that date April 4th and April 2nd depending on when I check, and I'm looking for an old program I have that can cast these charts. I have it on an old hard drive and it does everything completely offline. Let's just say I am the type of person who, despite being tech-savvy, has a bit of distrust towards online services that can change their backend data at will. I deal with that problem in a different arena already, outside of astrology, and that's one of the reasons I downloaded that program.

I definitely will check on those, now that you've mentioned them.

So, while you were away, I was looking at Sabian Symbols for other parts in my chart, and for whatever reason I stumbled upon the Part of Exile (Ascendant + Uranus - Saturn) and the Part of Sudden Parting (Ascendant - Saturn + Uranus)...

My Part of Exile is Gemini 15, and my Part of Sudden Parting is Gemini 18. For reference, my Ascendant is Gemini 16, so it's not quite conjunct Exile but it's right in the middle of them, closer to Exile.

Part of Exile:



Part of Sudden Parting:


So, what stands out to me about these parts? Well, while my Part of Exile isn't conjunct my Ascendant in Gemini 16, it's only one degree before it. The Gemini 18 symbol has shockingly close symbolism to the Gemini 15 one, too. But more importantly, these two parts both make me think of the symbolism for Sagittarius 22 where the Pars Hyleg is located, the one about a Chinese Laundry. Not sure if the Part of Exile being almost being a degree away from my Ascendant counts for anything, since it isn't conjunct, but it definitely feels like it would make sense if it did...

The thing is, if Exile implies separation from society and the Ascendant represents the body or identity, that isn't too far off from the truth.

I guess it goes back to the three characters I mentioned earlier. The only thing all three of them have in common is that all of them are dissatisfied with my life/body for different reasons. Althea doesn't want to live in my body because she is a woman. Solok finds my body annoying because it's human and thus runs out of energy quickly and can't maintain the level of Vulcan discipline and detachment he needs when pushing for my behavior to be more logical. James is the most comfortable with the body itself, but feels deeply alienated from the culture here in a lot of ways.

It could even be significant that it's the degree before my Ascendant, rather than my Ascendant. The Exile feeling hits the degree right before my identity, preventing it from integrating fully in the first place. It's right on the last degree of the 12th house, before the first one starts. So I'm stuck in this state of incoherency, like a milder version of what happened in Assassin's Creed when Clay experienced the "Bleeding Effect. He used the "Animus" machine too much and found that all his past life memories were blending into each other and he couldn't tell who he was or what century it was anymore. Only it's not quite making me insane so much as just overwhelmed and indecisive, because unlike in the game, the fragmented pieces are aware of each other and try to work together like an ineffective bureaucracy to run my life as well as they can, but they're not good at working together and are thus limited in what they can accomplish.

It would take too long to explain the game's story here, but basically, it involves a lot of stuff about an ancient organization called the Templars trying to control the world from behind the scenes and another ancient organization called the Assassins trying to stop them, and they have a machine that allows people to experience the memories of their ancestors and gain their skills and memories called the Animus. Basically, the whole plot revolves around stuff like ancient bloodlines, past lives, shadowy organizations, and the idea of the Biblical stories having a hidden meaning other than what we've been told.

I figure that if anything is within a one degree orb of anything else then, yes, it is conjunct... they just don't share the same Sabian Symbol...and at times I've found that the other Sabian adds to that of the more prominent of the two, and in your case that would be the Asc.

I saw movie "The Assassins' Creed", and I enjoyed it and it was very well done.

 

[piercethevale]

So, I checked out some of the other parts. I already know Jesus has his Part of Inheritance & Legacy conjunct my Part of Spirit, but I never checked out the symbol for mine because it doesn't overlap with anything in his chart or anything in mine. My Part of Inheritance & Legacy (Ascendant + Moon - Saturn) is:



Pisces 18, the next symbol over, is symbolically active in the USA chart, with a Part of Catastrophe and a Part of Intelligence/Skill. Pisces 19 is actually my Part of Friends and overlaps with the Part of Fortune given for Jesus. Pisces 17 is really just my own personal thing, it seems.

Well, I mean... the most obvious surface-level interpretation of this symbol is that my ancestors were people who went to church on Sunday? My Grandma's generation did, and probably the ones before that did too. But it got harder and harder to find a church we resonated with, until... we found ourselves living like some kind of American Christian version of the Essenes, keeping ourselves apart and cynically judging the way religious faith is expressed in our culture as somehow inadequate and maybe even corrupting.

I did actually just check, and my Grandma's chart has Pisces 17 as her Part of Fortune. So apparently I was right guessing that it had something to do with her generation. She was part of the Silent Generation, and she played a big role in raising me too, almost more than my actual parents. Especially since I wasn't going to school, I was at home with her a lot as a child, listening to her read stories about virtue. I even got interested in poetry by reading her Ideals magazines, and learned about astrology initially by reading her old Farmer's Almanac for the year I was born. I learned what a moon sign was for the first time and that mine was in Libra at a very young age, which stuck with me because I related to it more than my sun sign.

My Part of Love & Appreciation (Ascendant + Venus - Sun) is:



Now, that one is tough... I can't think of how this applies to my life? But I do know that in the chart of Jesus, his Part of Love & Appreciation is Leo 26, which is the same degree as my natal Lilith. And in the USA chart, it's Aries 12. So if Jesus loves and appreciates divine promise, and the US loves and appreciates the idea of natural law... then that must mean I love and appreciate... a good crisis and the opportunity it presents?

Well, I'm not going to lie, there have been a few times in my life when I tried to benefit from a crisis... like, one time I had just purchased a GPU right before there was a shortage. Then people were paying inflated prices on eBay for the graphics cards. I didn't really need mine that badly, and sold it for twice what I paid. Then I waited for the shortage to end, and bought a better card than the one I sold. I wasn't happy that the other people were suffering, but I was happy that I benefited from the situation, I guess? I don't know, I just can't think of a way that having this as my part of Love and Appreciation doesn't make me seem like a terrible person. LOL.

An Easter Parade...!?!?!?!!!


My first impression upon reading of the location of your Part of Love & Appreciation is that your life story about your difficulty in finding true love to be one that might spread through society, alerting all to the fact that many others are not alone, and others are having the difficulty they are having maintaining loving relationships, all due to the fact that society as a whole has become so perverse, so corrupted in thinking, as to what real love is all about. Not so much the fault of anyone as for having been subjected to so much "media" that presents love in so many perverse ways, establishing what constitutes a beautiful woman, a handsome man, the qualities she, or he, should have, and giving everyone the idea, the notion, that to settle for less, or to settle for different, is failure on some level.... and both overtly and subliminally.

 

[athenian200]

I figure that if anything is within a one degree orb of anything else then, yes, it is conjunct... they just don't share the same Sabian Symbol...and at times I've found that the other Sabian adds to that of the more prominent of the two, and in your case that would be the Asc.

I saw movie "The Assassins' Creed", and I enjoyed it and it was very well done.

That's good to know. It really does make a lot of sense. The thing I am "Exiled" from is my own body/identity, then. That is, the very point where all the Arabic Parts are derived from? That would really fit with not feeling at home in this existence, always wanting to write stories about being someone else, somewhere else, play video games, play D&D, do anything but live in the here and now.

Very surprised you've heard of Assassin's Creed at all, but it makes a lot of sense to me that you liked the movie, because it really does seem like the kind of story and setting you'd find interesting.

As for my Part of Service (Ascendant + Moon - Mercury), it looks like that part is the same Sabian Symbol as my Part of Spirit, Sagittarius 25. Both of those are conjunct Jesus' Part of Praise [Sentiment].

My Part of Bondage (Ascendant + Moon - Moon's Ruler [Venus]) is Libra 22:

PHASE 202 (LIBRA 22°): A CHILD GIVING BIRDS A DRINK AT A FOUNTAIN.

KEYNOTE: The concern of simple souls for the welfare and happiness of less-evolved beings who thirst for life renewal.

This is automatically conjunct my Part of Mother [Mind of Female], because it's the same formula (Ascendant + Moon - Venus). Interestingly, it looks like my Part of Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances (Ascendant + Sun - Fortune) is right next to this degree:

PHASE 201 (LIBRA 21°): A SUNDAY CROWD ENJOYING THE BEACH.

KEYNOTE: A revivifying contact with the Mother-force of nature and of social togetherness.

And we both know what Libra 20 is, it's my Part of Sudden Luck, and Jesus' Part of Communication and Speculation. So basically in my chart, every degree from Libra 20 to Libra 22 is symbolically active. Wait, actually... Libra 19 is my Part of Brethren (Ascendant + Jupiter - Saturn). So scratch that, everything from Libra 19 to Libra 22. No, wait a minute... Libra 18 is my Part of Play [Variety] (Ascendant + Venus - Mars). Everything from Libra 18 to Libra 22 has an astrological part on it? I'm going to have to look into that... that's weird, like the astrological part equivalent of a Stellium of planets, right?

The reverse formula for Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances (Ascendant + Fortune - Sun) is:

PHASE 311 (AQUARIUS 11°): DURING A SILENT HOUR, A MAN RECEIVES A NEW INSPIRATION WHICH MAY CHANGE HIS LIFE.

KEYNOTE: The need to rely upon inner inspiration and guidance at the start of new developments​

I certainly wouldn't mind having friends who I could relax with in an environment where my lack of career isn't as relevant, or have friends who feel inspired by me, so I guess the Illustrious & Noble Acquaintance parts do indeed work as expected.

 

[piercethevale]

That's good to know. It really does make a lot of sense. The thing I am "Exiled" from is my own body/identity, then. That is, the very point where all the Arabic Parts are derived from? That would really fit with not feeling at home in this existence, always wanting to write stories about being someone else, somewhere else, play video games, play D&D, do anything but live in the here and now.

Very surprised you've heard of Assassin's Creed at all, but it makes a lot of sense to me that you liked the movie, because it really does seem like the kind of story and setting you'd find interesting.

As for my Part of Service (Ascendant + Moon - Mercury), it looks like that part is the same Sabian Symbol as my Part of Spirit, Sagittarius 25. Both of those are conjunct Jesus' Part of Praise [Sentiment].

My Part of Bondage (Ascendant + Moon - Moon's Ruler [Venus]) is Libra 22:



This is automatically conjunct my Part of Mother [Mind of Female], because it's the same formula (Ascendant + Moon - Venus). Interestingly, it looks like my Part of Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances (Ascendant + Sun - Fortune) is right next to this degree:



And we both know what Libra 20 is, it's my Part of Sudden Luck, and Jesus' Part of Communication and Speculation. So basically in my chart, every degree from Libra 20 to Libra 22 is symbolically active. Wait, actually... Libra 19 is my Part of Brethren (Ascendant + Jupiter - Saturn). So scratch that, everything from Libra 19 to Libra 22. No, wait a minute... Libra 18 is my Part of Play [Variety] (Ascendant + Venus - Mars). Everything from Libra 18 to Libra 22 has an astrological part on it? I'm going to have to look into that... that's weird, like the astrological part equivalent of a Stellium of planets, right?

The reverse formula for Illustrious & Noble Acquaintances (Ascendant + Fortune - Sun) is:


I certainly wouldn't mind having friends who I could relax with in an environment where my lack of career isn't as relevant, or have friends who feel inspired by me, so I guess the Illustrious & Noble Acquaintance parts do indeed work as expected.

The 22nd degree of Libra is the location of my natal Neptune, it is also the natal Desc. of the USA. My natal Neptune is at 21* 52' 45" and it is in a strong conj. to my natal Saturn at 22* 17' 17", and thus within a half of a degree of orb. That aspect is what confers upon me the strong ability I have for meditation. It also gives me the ability to fix upon mental imagery, to bring it more into focus. The Sabian Symbol for my natal Saturn in the 23rd degree of Libra also is very relevant to, very validating, of the Sun rites I perform, as does that one Hyleg type Part I have that is derived from the post natal New Moon in the 20th of Leo, the one of Zuni Indians performing rites to the Sun. [ibid.] "LIBRA 23°: CHANTICLEER'S VOICE HERALDS SUNRISE."
I'm quite pleased that you have taken my suggestions and utilized them. What you have found for your two Parts concerning "Noble & Illustrious Acquaintances" are so validating to you. I can even see as to how they are, even though I have only what limited knowledge I have about you, from just these recent posts we've made in conversing.

As for Astrological Parts being as like that of a "stellium", I am unable to say as I have no personal experience with such as that. It is a very interesting matter, as a transiting force will conjunct them all in successive order. Your's is the only natal chart that I've ever heard of before that has such a "stellium" like arrangement. Perhaps you will be one to inform all the rest of us, and future generations, about how this arrangement is of effect?
You may find it useful to know that one of the earliest theories I had about transiting forces and the Sabians concerns retrogrades. I have a theory, and have presented here in the forum in a number of threads, but very early threads that I made. It is that I believe that the point, I.e. the Zodiacal degree, at which a transiting object goes retrograde is sort of an impasse, a precept that the particular object cannot proceed beyond until it returns back to the point, the degree, as to where it then turns direct again. It is at that point, where it goes direct again, that [the Sabian involved] is of the precept it must reinforce itself with so as to proceed past that point of impasse. One should consider what the nature of that transiting object is, e.g. Venus being that of love and appreciation, the arts, etc., or, for another example, Pluto being that of transformation. Thus, if a transiting force goes retrograde when conjunct one of your Parts, note what that Part represents, what the nature of the object is, and the Sabians involved at the point of retrograde and the return to direct. I believe that the Sabian found for that point of direct return will be the answer to whatever the hangup is blocking progress. ... I'm having a difficult time trying to explain this clearly, I hope that it makes sense. It's the poor verbal skills I was given, perhaps you'll find a way to express it more clearly but, then again, this is only a theory and only worth the effort to indulge me if you find any validity to it?

Another thing to keep in mind, is that many believe that the only transiting force of effect is that which is involved in the formula for that Part. I've been seeing strong indications of that. As for what happened that April 18th, in 2013 regarding the USA's natal Part of Liberty, Uranus was the transiting force and the Sun and Mercury are involved in that formula, but Uranus is the "Higher Octave" of Mercury and thus I think that's why it seemingly did have affected the nation, unless it was just by coincidence? [I know that I mentioned this in the thread in the "chat" forum regarding Pluto's planetary status and that You did read that post I made.] I also wrote about my prediction for December 14th, in 2012, regarding Pluto being conjunct that day with the USA's Part of Repression, and that it had passed the point of exact conjunction with the Part of Termination, but was still within a one degree orb of conjunction. While the Part of Repression does involve Pluto in that Parts formula, the Part of Termination does not and thus it may just have been a coincidence that it seemed that Pluto was involved in the "termination" of something or other, as I wrote back then that I thought that there was an attempt to terminate some of the principles of the 2nd Amendment, I.e. the right to bear arms. Yet, it certainly did, and still does, seem to have been about repressing society and those rights.

You've got a good handle on all of this regarding the validity of the Sabian Symbols and how they work in relation to a natal chart. You're just a few years older than I was when I first earnestly started taking astrology seriously and set about trying to learn more of it. It seems that you may have begun at an even earlier age, although my studies of the readings of Edgar Cayce proved advantageous too, [and it was the readings of Edgar Cayce that inspired my brother to get into the study of astrology and I was handed what he had learned.] You have an advantage in that it took me until I was in my 50's to finally find the validity that Astrological Parts are relevant to Sabian Symbols. Prior to that I only had little more than a hunch, as my own Part of Fortune seemed appropriately so, but it is also conjunct my M.C. and I had been open to the possibility that it was only the coincidence. However, after I produced a chart for the date Edgar Cayce gave for the date Edgar said that Jesus/Yeshu'a was born and had the time of day dialed in as to where Pluto was conjunct the Asc., and also noticed that the four axis points where exactly those that Rudhyar inferred would be found on the "Naz's" natal chart [the 1st degrees of the four Cardinal Signs] the very next thing I did was to calculate what the Part of Fortune was [as at that time I'm pretty sure that astrodienst didn't have that app available, or if it did I was not aware and utilizing it] and when I looked that Parts' location up in my book by Rudhyar, on the Sabian Symbols, and saw what it was... I was ecstatic.... and then as time progressed I was rather stunned to find that so many, if not all, do. [and I'm certain that they all do but it's due to my limited knowledge about the man and his life.]

The fellow, Rick, that was loaning me the use of his laptop to achieve this, and was there alone with me in my room at that old hotel in Folsom, Calif. [an old friend that later shared an apt. with me for many years, until his passing in 2023] was later asked, on a few occasions, by a few people that knew us both as to whether or not I had truly produced the natal chart of Jesus. Rick didn't know anything about astrology, or Edgar Cayce, other than what I or any others may have told him, and Rick told me that his reply to that question was simply; "I don't know, but He got awfully excited when he saw it."
The Sabian Symbol for your reverse Part of Noble & Illustrious Acquaintances has got me stoked. To have such people deem you as such for the precept of that Sabian is, I think, a "sign" that you will go far in such studies, astrology being one of them, and will then further advance this "science".
You have the intellect, the spiritual nature, and the necessary humility, to be a source of guidance, a force for good. You may even become a teacher of renown, a "guru" if I may use the term? Regardless of any level of recognition or acclaim you may, or may not, acquire, I feel my time spent in replying to your posts has been very well spent.

 

[athenian200]

The 22nd degree of Libra is the location of my natal Neptune, it is also the natal Desc. of the USA. My natal Neptune is at 21* 52' 45" and it is in a strong conj. to my natal Saturn at 22* 17' 17", and thus within a half of a degree of orb. That aspect is what confers upon me the strong ability I have for meditation. It also gives me the ability to fix upon mental imagery, to bring it more into focus. The Sabian Symbol for my natal Saturn in the 23rd degree of Libra also is very relevant to, very validating, of the Sun rites I perform, as does that one Hyleg type Part I have that is derived from the post natal New Moon in the 20th of Leo, the one of Zuni Indians performing rites to the Sun. [ibid.] "LIBRA 23°: CHANTICLEER'S VOICE HERALDS SUNRISE."

It's kind of interesting that your Saturn is right near the end of that symbol sequence, and adds one more degree onto it compared to what I have in my natal chart. Bringing me to "Sunrise," when normally I would stop at Libra 22.

So, my interactions with the USA chart are... interesting. My Part of Hidden Identity is conjunct the USA's natal Part of War, and my Part of Bondage is conjunct the USA's Natal Descendant. This is really lining up with my "James" personality literally or figuratively being an 18th century Redcoat for whatever reason. In bondage to the USA's enemies at time of its formation, and the target of the natal Part of War? Oh, and Libra 20 is the USA's Part of Bankruptcy, and my Part of Sudden Luck... almost sounding like if I survived, it was only because the USA's money was "Not worth a Continental" at the time, thus the troops were poorly equipped, allowing me to escape death on many occasions. I was expecting the Redcoat symbolism in my dreams to be more metaphorical, not to be reflected astrologically in comparisons with the USA natal chart like this.

As for Astrological Parts being as like that of a "stellium", I am unable to say as I have no personal experience with such as that. It is a very interesting matter, as a transiting force will conjunct them all in successive order. Your's is the only natal chart that I've ever heard of before that has such a "stellium" like arrangement. Perhaps you will be one to inform all the rest of us, and future generations, about how this arrangement is of effect?

Ah, so this isn't actually common? Definitely worth keeping an eye on that section of Libra, then. Whatever is going on there is clearly very important for me as a person.

I'm having a difficult time trying to explain this clearly, I hope that it makes sense. It's the poor verbal skills I was given, perhaps you'll find a way to express it more clearly but, then again, this is only a theory and only worth the effort to indulge me if you find any validity to it?

I think I understand you well enough, though. The Sabian degree at which a planet turns retrograde represents blockage, and the Sabian degree where it turns direct again represents what must be learned/reinforced before things can move forwards, right? The planet itself reveals the context in which the symbols should be interpreted. It was clear to me. If people misunderstand you, it's likely because a lot of people have a short attention span, and you tend to include a lot of details, expressing the full complexity of what's in your mind.

The Sabian Symbol for your reverse Part of Noble & Illustrious Acquaintances has got me stoked. To have such people deem you as such for the precept of that Sabian is, I think, a "sign" that you will go far in such studies, astrology being one of them, and will then further advance this "science".
You have the intellect, the spiritual nature, and the necessary humility, to be a source of guidance, a force for good. You may even become a teacher of renown, a "guru" if I may use the term? Regardless of any level of recognition or acclaim you may, or may not, acquire, I feel my time spent in replying to your posts has been very well spent.

I'm glad that you feel that way, there were a few times I was worried that I was taking up too much of your time. I mostly study because... well, I feel like there are things I need to know about myself that neither traditional religion nor science would dare to try answering. Even normal astrological techniques haven't worked this far. Things I need to know to make sense of the life I've lived, and nothing started to add up until I reached this level of analysis.

So, there was one other part that had really interesting symbolism to me, and it goes with all the others. Some call it the Part of Sons, and others call it the Part of Dependence. The formula is Ascendant + Jupiter - Moon. The formula itself is very similar to the Part of Hidden Identity/Oration, which is Ascendant + Saturn - Moon. I have no idea what the part represents, but my gut is telling me it would be odd if just swapping Jupiter for Saturn in that formula resulted in something related to offspring rather than something relevant to a native's chart.

The reason is because whatever that part represents, here's my Sabian Symbol for it:

PHASE 288 (CAPRICORN 18°): THE UNION JACK FLAG FLIES FROM A BRITISH WARSHIP.

KEYNOTE: The protection afforded to individuals and groups by powerful institutions in charge of maintaining order.

So that is to say, whatever Ascendant + Jupiter - Moon represents in my chart, it seems like it's connected to a similar theme as Ascendant + Saturn - Moon... though I can't put my finger on it yet.

 

[piercethevale]

So, I made a list of all the parts I could find that overlap with a part I have, for the April 2nd chart for Jesus... some of the parts are probably not too useful, and I mentioned some of these earlier, but I thought it would be wise to leave this post as a reference for myself so I could come back later and go over them all. I'm not yet sure what to make of the pattern, other than it seeming like it's shockingly easy to find overlapping parts between my chart and this one...



PHASE 150 (LEO 30°): AN UNSEALED LETTER.

Jesus: Part of Fascination [Perversion] (Ascendant + Venus - Uranus)
athenian200: Part of Gossip (Ascendant + Mercury - Neptune)



PHASE 7 (ARIES 7°): A MAN SUCCEEDS IN EXPRESSING HIMSELF SIMULTANEOUSLY IN TWO REALMS.

Jesus: Part of Debate [Daring Action, Arrogance] (Ascendant + Mars - Jupiter)
athenian200: Part of Death (medieval) (House 8th + Saturn - Moon)



PHASE 355 (PISCES 25°): A RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATION SUCCEEDS IN OVERCOMING THE CORRUPTING INFLUENCE OF PERVERTED PRACTICES AND MATERIALIZED IDEALS.

Jesus: Part of Discord (Ascendant + Jupiter - Mars)
athenian200: Natal Mercury position, Part of Merchandise I (Ascendant + Moon - Spirit)

Observations to the above that I should have noticed and commented on earlier.
Your Part of Gossip has a most appropriate Sabian Symbol for someone that can't help them self from spreading gossip. Take it as a admonition to hold your tongue whenever you hear any and are about to share it. That same degree is president Trump's natal Asc. and knowing that it is easy to understand why he talks incessantly most of the time. If only he were aware of this Astrological condition he has, then he might recognize that it is a personality quirk that he needs to be ever aware of.

As to a Part of Merchandise, the only formula that I know of, that I have listed, is Asc. + Part of Fortune - Part of Soul, and I think that tile is dubious although it may be strictly for horary. The formula you gave is an unknown.

Your Part of Death being in the 7th deg. of Aries is most interesting. That is the Sign and degree of Suryakant's natal M.C. and he was the reincarnation of Sir Galahad. According to legend Sir Galahad was the only knight to find[attain?] the Holy Grail and as a reward "angels ascended Him unto Heaven without his having to experience physical death, and thus became the man of two realms." That is what an Ascended being, and Ascended Master is, one that "ascended" unto Heaven. They can manifest themselves in a physical form here on earth and return to the Heavenly realm at will. That it is your Part of Death is a curious thing... Suryakant was an Ascended being yet the need was that he be born and live a life among others unaware of the fact. I might even speculate that upon your demise you will then realize that you too are an Ascended soul that chose to incarnate by birth for whatever "mission" you might have in life? But, the Part of Death, in my experience to date, has only come up once and regarding the rectified natal chart of Hillary Clinton. Clairvoyant, Clarisse Conner, told me that her true birth time is [I forget the exact amount, I don't have that info at hand] 3 or 4, and it might have been 4 1/2 minutes earlier, and when I cast a chart using that for the data, her natal Asc. is exactly conj. the Part of Death. Clarisse said that she was born not breathing, thus she was born with the awareness of Death. But, as to the Sabian Symbol being of significance to that Part I cannot say. I could try to find that thread I wrote about Hillary and her rectified natal chart to find what Sign and degree her Asc. and Po Death are in to find out what the Sabian Symbol for the two is, but it's a bit more than I wish to spend time at. You're welcome to do that research if you care to, but I think that even your time could be better spent at other endeavors.

PHASE 315 (AQUARIUS 15°): TWO LOVEBIRDS SITTING ON A FENCE AND SINGING HAPPILY.

Jesus: Part of Termination [Occultism] (Ascendant + Uranus - Neptune)
athenian200: Part of Obligations (Ascendant + Mars - Venus)



PHASE 115 (CANCER 25°): A WILL-FULL MAN IS OVERSHADOWED BY A DESCENT OF SUPERIOR POWER.

Jesus: Part of Bankruptcy (Jupiter - Neptune + Uranus)
athenian200: Part of Influence & Magnetism (Ascendant + Pluto - Moon)

PHASE 191 (LIBRA 11°): A PROFESSOR PEERING OVER HIS GLASSES AT HIS STUDENTS.

Jesus: Part of Sudden Advancement (Ascendant + Fortune - Saturn)
athenian200: Part of Speculation [Behest] (Ascendant + Jupiter - Neptune)

The Part of Obligations is about obligations in romance, and seemingly in artistic endeavors too. But what a marvelous Sabian Symbol for one to have in this Part. I can only interpret this to mean that you recognize it as an obligation to make them happy. That's what most every partner hopes for from their significant other, i.e. a sense of obligation to keep "happiness" in the relationship. Check your Part of Self Sacrifice [Asc. + Venus - Pluto] and as it is in the 2nd degree of Capricorn, keep that Sabian in mind as their is a point where an obligation may become as such that one has to consider that sacrificing of their self, and as Rudhyar warned what could be lost by doing so is "the principle of love and compassion. Keep the following adage in mind [in case you ever find yourself in such a situation] "Hold on tightly, let go lightly".

Awesome Sabian Symbol for ones Part of Influence & Magnetism. Yet, that is an unconfirmed title being that it's yet another Part that I yet to investigate. Yeshu'a's is in the 3rd deg. of Libra. If you ever have the time and the inclination, read the Sabian Symbols in reverse order from Libra 06* to Libra 01* [and you might even try from Libra 07*, and Libra 08*, and even from Libra 09*] and think about the last days of Yeshu'a with his disciples as you read through them. It like a outline of the events that transpired during those last days, at least it seems as so to me, but I'm not as well studied in those matters as others are.

Jesus' Part of Sudden Advancement is in the 11th degree of Gemini, and a most appropriate Sabian Symbol it is. It validates what Edgar Cayce said concerning the "Lost Years", as Jesus/Yeshu'a allegedly traveled to many foreign lands and received advanced teachings in various subjects from different teachers. Persia and India were two of those foreign lands. He had some kind of initiating rite in the Great Pyramid. Truly, it is that which provided his "sudden Advancement", and as it took 18 years for him to complete that journey, it surely must have seemed to have be as like a "nemesis" as well.
I glanced through the list of his Parts and didn't see any natal Part of his in the 11th degree of Libra, but I might have missed it, if there is.