Listing of all Astrological Parts for the USA, [zero hour July 4, 1776 chart]

[Phoenix Venus]

Bumpity bump bump....

...i wouldnt mind seeing this thread moved to the arabic parts section...

 

[piercethevale]

Bumpity bump bump....

...i wouldnt mind seeing this thread moved to the arabic parts section...

I agree. As they have condensed three sub forums into one here, very recently, this thread will get buried rather quickly. it and the other two listings I have should be "Stickys" in fact... or at least this one and the complete listing of Parts. Seeing as how the Yeshu'a chart still has more opposition than support it will just have to wait until it gets it's props. ...and it will eventually, we both know that.
How about making some suggestions to admin?

 

[piercethevale]

I added the Part of Bondage to the list.
Asc + - Depositor [Ruler, same thing] of Moon and give position of Part for both Saturn as ruler of Aquarius and for Jupiter as the ruler of the same sign.
If anyone prefers a different ruler over the sign of Aquarius ...as I believe I've heard that some think it to be Uranus... substitute it for the "Trigger" in the formula for the Part.

Frankly I think the Sabian Symbol that is produced for the Jupiter rulership formula to be much easier to comprehend what the United States is in bondage to as for a precept. That being the 3rd degree of Sagittarius [ibid.]

"SAGITTARIUS 3°: TWO MEN PLAYING CHESS.
KEYNOTE: The transcendent ritualization of conflict.
Essential to socio-cultural living is the transmutation of man's natural aggressiveness under most conditions of existence. Many rituals, sports and games have no other basic aim. In chess the complex types of energies which in their togetherness constitute a human person are symbolized by six kinds of pieces (king, queen, bishops, knights, rooks and pawns). The struggle between light and darkness (the Yang and Yin forces) is ritualized, ending in most cases with the checkmating of the king (the ego, the conscious self). In a dualistic world such a contest between polarized forces is omnipresent. The chess game trains men to be more objective, more careful, more aware of whole situations — and less impulsive and intent upon side issues.
This third stage symbol deals with conflict, but at the level of group culture and psychological symbolization. It brings to the objective consciousness the basic realities in interpersonal INTERPLAY."


The United States is a nation of very competitively oriented people. It thrives on competition. In fact it would probably vanish in a generation or two if the competitiveness of its society were to suddenly be no more.

As to what the Saturn rulership formula produces as for the Sabian Symbol for what is derived from that formula for the location of the Part of Bondage: [ibid.]

"LEO 24°: TOTALLY CONCENTRATED UPON INNER SPIRITUAL ATTAINMENT, A MAN IS SITTING IN A STATE OF COMPLETE NEGLECT OF BODILY APPEARANCE AND CLEANLINESS.
KEYNOTE: An interior focalization of energy and consciousness at the expense of all forms of outward activity and care.
This traditional image of the Hindu holy man in the typical Western mind may well hide the fact that without proper training and intense concentration, what we usually consider spiritual attainment, self-realization and the 'God experience' is not possible. The 'intoxicated chickens' of the Leo 21° symbol must learn self-discipline if they want to 'fly'. There can be no halfway measures if the goal of true Yoga is to be reached.
This fourth stage symbol, as usual, suggests a certain kind of 'technique', or at least an adequate means to reach an envisioned goal. The means is TOTAL CONCENTRATION.
....uh,yeah... I DON'T THINK SO.

Sagittarius 03* walks away with the title here...imho... if fact I see it as "no contest" but maybe that's just my point of view... or im not so ho...

 

[piercethevale]

In the mundane astrology sub-forum a member posted a thread asking for assistance in recalling the natal data for the U.S.A., as they obviously are oblivious to this natal chart, i.e. the "Zero Hour" natal chart of the nation, or they just can't recognize the validity of it, astrologically.

So I posted [#3] a reply in the effort to encourage their studying of it and provided a very good example of why it's the only chart possibly valid by giving a four year timeline accounting of Pluto all through the American Civil War.

I do recommend reading it for anyone that is yet unconvinced of this "Zero Hour" chart being the only valid natal chart for the U.S.A., or who has just taken up an interest in the subject and would like to learn more as I found the Civil War to be one of the most convincing timeline studies I ever seen given for rhe natal astrology of the USA.
Here's the link https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=133833

 

[piercethevale]

An update that is essential. That is the amount of the Sidereal secession since the birth of the USA, which should be added to all natal positions in order to accommodate, what will be by the end of today, April 20, [Happy 420, BTW] 2024, 90,506 days since. As I simplified things a bit, mathematically ... not wanting to get into the controversy of the exact timing of the Ahimsa, the Tropical to Sidereal relative movement of one full degree being based on the proposed endurance of one great yuga being 25, 800 years, exactly, and that amounts to, apprx., one degree every 26,176.25 days That amounts to one second of a degree in difference every 7.271180555...6 days.
It all adds up to a difference, by the end of this day, EDST, of 3 degrees 27 minutes and 27.22220 seconds, or 03* 27' 27.22220", that is the amount to add to all natal positions of the Astrological Parts derived from this particular natal chart.

I had to recalculate all the necessary as I'm still in Reno, without my papers, my notebooks, my books and the loss of some atmosphere of inspiration. These todays' figures might even be the same as those that I had been using and espousing before? But I think they are just slightly different. As it takes over seven days for the sidereal to move at least one second of a degree whether it be a month or two more, or less, amounting to no more than about 8.25 seconds of a degree. Then figure on adding four seconds every 29.0847222...3 days. That is to say on May 20th at 12 minutes and 13 seconds, i.e. 12:12:13 A.M. on May 20, 2024 EDST, add four more seconds to the figure I gave above.
My interest in this mater today stems from my realization how close the second return of Pluto to its natal position, Sidereal procession adj., in retrograde this July 16th. I'm curious as to any planetary stimulation to the natal Parts at that upcoming time.
Here's the event chart, although I may have already posted it before, twice won't hurt.

LATE EDIT: Going by what I give for the actual point of natal return for that day in this chart cast some years ago, The ratio I've used in this last post to apprx. the rate of the Sidereal secession would then produce one more second of a degree. I Will refer to the older estimation to be the more accurate, but a difference that amounts to just a hair more than a second in degree difference over a period of almost 248 years.
EVEN LATER EDIT: Checking the current info that google offers about the rate of Sidereal precession, which is given at every 25,772 years [which is surely an approximation but likely with a half a year more or less] that produces a rate of + 0.1375292488419846" of a degree per day, which in turn then gives a sidereal precession adjusted position for the USA's natal Pluto at 3* 27' 59", a difference of 15" of a degree. But not to sweat it much, Pluto will conj. that exact point at apprx 4:05 A.M. the same day. i.e July 18, 2024, just 4 hours earlier.

It's the retrograde returns I pay the most attention to. as that is what has proven itself to me to be the more interesting conjunctions of return when they do happen.

LATE EDIT: OR AS EARLY AS... DEPENDING ON THE TRUE RATE OF THE SIDEREALPRECESSION... BUT DEFINITELY ON JULY 16, 2024...

 

[piercethevale]

I'm very much interested when Uranus next conjuncts the USA's Sidereal precession adjusted, natal position f its Part of Destiny which will occure arund the beginning of the third week of June in 2028, after Uranus will have made its own natal return the year before, its third. The first occurred in 1860 just mere days before the outbreak of the Civil War. Uranus will conj. the Tropical Zodiacal position almost exactly the year before.
I find the Saban Symbol for the USA's Part of Destiny to be so, very, "Right On"
[ibid.]
"GEMINI 8°: AROUSED STRIKERS SURROUND A FACTORY.

KEYNOTE: The disruptive power of the ambitious mind upon the organic wholeness of human relationship.

We are dealing in this sequence of symbols with man's discovery of the new powers residing in his special contribution to the total organism of this planet Earth — his consciousness and aggressive mind. The first stage (Phase 66) dealt with oil, the typical form of energy which the modern mind has made available. (These symbols were revealed before atomic energy was even thought of as a practical possibility.) Now we see in this new symbol a pictorial indication of what the use of this intellect-generated energy inevitably leads to: industrial unrest and violence. As man manages to rape the earth in order to demonstrate his power and intensify his pleasures and his sense of proud mastery, conflicts and disruptive processes are inevitably initiated.

The arousal is presented to us here in its collective social form because we have reached the emotional-cultural level. The type of power generated by the analytical intellectual faculties is essentially disruptive; it is based on the destruction of matter, and invites egocentric hoarding and spoliation — and, in general, privileges of one kind or another. This leads to a REVOLT AGAINST PRIVILEGES."

Right there in Dane's keywords, "REVOLT AGAINST PRIVLEGES", one finds, basically, the entire philosophical foundation of this nations origins... Uranus is the "Great Awakener"... Set your alarm clocks.

 

[piercethevale]

i EDITED POST #45 ABOVE TO ALLOW FOR THE DIFFERENCE GIVEN BETWEEN THE TWO EXTREMES CURRENTLY GIVEN FOR THE RATE OF sIDEREAL PRECESSION, ONE GIVEN AS 25,800 YEARS THE OTHER AS 25, 772 YEARS. iF THE RATE IS AS FAST AS BEING EXACTLY ONE DEGREE EVERY 71.5 YEARS, i.e. ONE COMPLETE CYCLE, OR GREAT YUGA,THEN BEING 25,740 YEARS. THEN THE EVENT WILL BE AS EARLY AS 11;35 P.M., THE PREVIOUS DAY, JULY 15.

 

[piercethevale]

What I have found unnerving, although I've yet to do a thorough going over of all the potential planetary transits to the natal postion of Astrological Parts, both Topical and that adjusted for the Sidereal precession that will occur over 90,592-3 days that will have transpired on the occassion of the second natal retun of Pluto this year, is that Uranus, at 26* 22' will have made a conjunction to the natal Topical position of the Part of Innocence at 25* 06' 55" and the Part of Surety [my tenative, but with extreme pejudice, title for the astrological Part derived from the formula that is opposite that of the Part of Catastrophe, in that I feel that the opposite of a catastrophe is an event that goees assuredly, without a glitch, seamlessly, ] is at 25* 14' 55" on July 10th and the 14th. What is even moe disturbing is that the Part of Innocence and the Part of Surety share the same degree and Sabian Symbol. Uranus will not conjunct the Sidereal precession adjusted point for either Part until the second week of June, next year, in 2025. That will be around apprx 28* :taurus 34' to 49".
[ibid.]
"TAURUS 26°: A SPANISH GALLANT SERENADES HIS BELOVED.
KEYNOTE: The ritualization of individual desires.
At this level we see the play of collective values as they affect the individual person and indeed confirm his individuality by giving it a solid basis in a tradition. The individual is still attached to these group-values; he 'belongs'. Nevertheless, this state is necessary for a safe and secure sense of differentiation within an enfolding whole. Music and the culturally acceptable rituals of love are cultural products, yet each person can use them for the spontaneous fulfillment of his very own desires.
This is the first symbol in the twelfth five-fold series. It reveals the individual human being making use of his personal status to find fulfillment and a sense of social identity. This is ROLE-PLAYING in its most enjoyable form."

This is disturbing because it reveals that We, as a nation, assuredly tryto play a role we have not the least idea of how to play it.
This rings so true of what Edgar Cayce said was the sin of the United States, i.e. that We don't live up to the motto we place so prominently on our currencey, r.e. "IN GOD WE TRUST". We want to be that entity, but we, for the greater part of ourselves, are nothing more than poseurs
In addition Saturn will be conjunct the Tropical Zodiacs' natal position for the Part of Catastrophe, at 17* 44' 11' and the Part of Itelligence and Skill, at 17* 52' 11" which both are in the 18th degree of Pisces this May 14th and 16th, and again such an ironic paradox in having the same degree and same Sabian Symbol of what is our most skillful application of our intelligence is also that whch brings us "catastrophe"... [ibid.]

"
PISCES 18°: IN A GIGANTIC TENT, VILLAGERS WITNESS A SPECTACULAR PERFORMANCE.

KEYNOTE: The collective appeal of a well-staged and exciting display of skill and/or oratory.

At first, Marc Jones interpreted the 'gigantic tent' as the locale for a revivalist's meeting; later he suggested a circus tent instead. In a sense, the basic meaning is the same whether it is the traditional performance of skilled clowns, acrobats or animal trainers, or that of a religious fundamentalist dramatizing an old religious imagery, what takes place is the use of personal achievement and conviction to bring a crowd to a state of enthusiasm sufficient to make it forget its boredom with everyday routine or its familiar sins of commission or omission.

At this third stage of the seventieth five-fold sequence, the individual person and the collectivity are brought together in a significant performance which subtly strengthens the communal spirit directly or indirectly. The implication of the symbol, whenever it is found operating, is that the time has come for the individual to dare to present himself and his works to his community for applause, or for the purpose of attracting a following. What is suggested is PUBLIC SELF-DRAMATIZATION."

Oh, my yes... don't our politicians give such gradiose speeches and campaign promises? Obama sure did...and failed to deliver a single one.
We are so good at givng grand promises... how about all those treaties our gov't made with the indigenous tribes? We broke every single one.
What about all the grandoise promises we make to other countries as well?

Saturn will get within one degree of an exact conjunction to the Sidereal precession adjusted position for those two Parts when it goes retrograde at 19* 26' on June 29th this year and will make those exact conjs. the first week of next March in 2025.

 

[piercethevale]

A Saturn conjunction to the Part of Catastrophe and the Part of Intelligence and Skill, TRopical Zodac this mid May, then again in rx this August, and early next February, then there's Saturn conj. the Sidereal precession adjusted point come June and then again next March... and the Sabian Symbolism which can be so easily intepreted as both Skillful, intelligently conceived, oratory and public displays of other communicative means and also of great, catastrophically, hazardous speeches, campaign promises, campaign lies, and the basest type of mudslinging all occuring over the last four months of the campaigns and through the rest of theyear and into the first month of the new, or same old, admin taking office in February of 2025.
....WHEW..... I'm fatigued from just thinking about the likelihood of it all.
...and then from that point to Uranus' third return, the Tropical in 2027 with the Sidereal following in 2028, and Uranus conj. the natal Part of Destiny during that time... which has a Sabian Symbol of, in Dane's Keywords', "REVOLT AGAINST PRIVLEGES", AND GIVING CONSIDERATION TO EDGAR CAYCE'S PREDICTON OF ANOTHER CIVIL WAR IN THE USA NOT LONG AFTER THE TURN OF THE 21ST CENTURY THAT, IF IT SHOULD HAPPEN, WILL BE ONE OF ECONOMIC REASONS, I.E ''THE HAVE MORES" VS THE HAVE TOO LITTLES"... and that it was right after Uranus' first return that the Civil War of the 1860's occurred... WELL, YOU DO THE MATH.

 

[piercethevale]

All I'm saying as to the above is "KEEP THIS IN MIND" during the times of aspect given...and remember that old adage; "FOREWARNED IS FOREARMED."
Thanks for reading, ptv

 

[athenian200]

So, I was looking over your chart for the US, and for some reason I decided to look at the Sabian Symbol for the Part of Wastefulness.

PHASE 359 PISCES 29°): LIGHT BREAKING INTO MANY COLORS THROUGH A PRISM.

KEYNOTE: The analytical power of the mind necessary for the formulation of life processes in their many aspects.

Cycles of existence begin in unity and end in what I have called "multi-unity." At the stage of consummation the many individual differences are totaled; they constitute a sum. Within that sum — a unified total — the inevitability of the future process of differentiation is implied, because every cycle leaves a mass of waste products slowly returning to the unconscious state of chemical matter, of "humus." What the symbol tells us is that unity will always break again into multiplicity. The "prism" is always there. There is no absolute unity; if anything could be called "absolute" it is the relationship between the One and the Many.

This fourth stage symbol of the concluding five-fold sequence of phases points to the fundamental type of operation in all modes of existence. The most beautiful and seemingly everlasting experience of unity will in time be superseded by the need to attend to a multiplicity of details. Existence implies DIFFERENTIATION.

After reading it, I suddenly got this mental image of the Latin motto printed on our coins. "E Pluribus Unum," which means.... "Of many, one." Then when I looked near the end of the thread, you were actually talking about how we don't live up to the other motto printed on our coins... "In God we Trust." I'm suddenly remembering the Wizard of Oz, too. The Wizard in that movie didn't call the United States the land of "In God We Trust," he called it the land of "E Pluribus Unum." Which might well mean it's closer to the truth on some level, but that this isn't a productive or good thing?

So it's almost like... we lived up to the Latin motto in a way, because we were unified at first and slowly drifted apart from the initial unity in pursuit of an ever more individualistic and atomized society, but living up to that motto doesn't really achieve anything and is kind of meaningless and materialistic if you think about it. It makes me think of wasted potential or misused potential somehow.

 

[piercethevale]

So, I was looking over your chart for the US, and for some reason I decided to look at the Sabian Symbol for the Part of Wastefulness.



After reading it, I suddenly got this mental image of the Latin motto printed on our coins. "E Pluribus Unum," which means.... "Of many, one." Then when I looked near the end of the thread, you were actually talking about how we don't live up to the other motto printed on our coins... "In God we Trust." I'm suddenly remembering the Wizard of Oz, too. The Wizard in that movie didn't call the United States the land of "In God We Trust," he called it the land of "E Pluribus Unum." Which might well mean it's closer to the truth on some level, but that this isn't a productive or good thing?

So it's almost like... we lived up to the Latin motto in a way, because we were unified at first and slowly drifted apart from the initial unity in pursuit of an ever more individualistic and atomized society, but living up to that motto doesn't really achieve anything and is kind of meaningless and materialistic if you think about it. It makes me think of wasted potential or misused potential somehow.

The Part of Wastefullness [Asc. + - ] is not an Astrological Part that I've ever gotten around to studying. If you will notice I placed a question mark in parenthesis after the given title for the Part.

As like the given title for Asc. + - , which had been labeled as the Part of False Love, which has been founded, and demonstrated, to actually be a Part of Ideal Love, I believe the given title of "Wastefulness" is likely in error.

It was Edgar Cayce that said that the United States doesn't live up to the motto of "In God We Trust". Yet I do inherently agree with anything Edgar had to say while he was "in trance"

I am now feeling compelled to study this Astrological Part titled "Wastefulness". Right off the bat I think... and using the same principle that allowed me to realize what the true title of the Part of False Love actually is, i.e.the vision [Neptune] of "Love" that is born out of the Heart [Venus], then what Uranus produces [greater awareness, sudden change, etc.] that is born from ones Heart [Venus] I doubt that it could be termed as "wasteful".

If I am on the "right track" then that Sabian Symbol does seem to be most insightful. As out of many different colonies, and a number of them originally founded to be havens for different beliefs of Faith, and some founded on different political precepts and of differing cultural backgrounds, then as to the motto of "out of many, One", then the Sabian Symbol does make sound sense, as what nation prior to the United States could claim to be One born from a number of so many differences?

Thank you for this reply as it brought up an issue that needed to be addressed and contemplated on... and your insight pertaining to that particular motto in Latin seemingly may be the key to the resolution of this issue.
You may have an inherent knack for understanding Astrological Parts, or at least helping to resolve issues pertaining to those wrongly identified.

I'll try to delve more into the study of this Part as soon as it is possible for me to give it some concentrated attention,